PDA

View Full Version : PE8 encoding very slow - please read carefully


TheViking
December 8th, 2009, 08:21 AM
Hi,

I have just started using PE8 recently. I have used Premiere Pro before with Matrox RT.X2, but since its too expensive to buy, I thought I will buy PE8. And also, PE8 is one of the only software that is able to recognise '.TOD' files.

My problem is:
I have a JVC GZ-HD7. Firstly, PE8 cannot 'see' my camera either using Firewire or USB. So there is no way of me importing the footage directly from the camera into PE8. Using the USB cable, I was able to copy the required footage into a folder and then be able to import it into PE8 as files.

So, having imported all the files in near HD(1920 x 1080i) format, I begin my editing. I drag all the files to the timeline. Since i am just experimenting, I didnt add any effects or transitions to the timeline. I went straight to export to DVD.

But I am finding that the encoding is very slow. I have a Core i7 920 processor overclocked to 3.4. But even with 8 threads the maximum the processor is used is about 37%. The last thread seems to do most of the work. But i was expecting the processor to run flat out.

I am running Vista Home Premium 32bit. I have 6gb ram, Ati Radeon 4870(cat.9.6) drivers, 3 drives(300gb velociraptor, 500GB Seagate, 1TB Seagate).

The OS and Apps on the Raptor, Data on the 500GB and all my videos on the 1TB. The scratch disk is on the 1TB.

The encoding to DVD takes a long time. I found that it only reached 18% in 1hr.

How can I speed it up.

Thanks in advance.

Dev.

ATR
December 8th, 2009, 11:21 AM
Dev

I have read your post carefully and will be back shortly with full questions and comments.

ATR

ATR
December 8th, 2009, 01:25 PM
Dev

I have read your post very carefully and have several major questions that need answers before I attempt to address the bottom line that brought you here, namely, how to correct what you consider slow burn to DVD disc time.

I thought I will buy PE8. And also, PE8 is one of the only software that is able to recognise '.TOD' files.
Both Premiere Elements 7 and 8 Import/Export Formats Supported lists include MOD as well as TOD. In spite of that, the import of MOD files have typically been problematic, from pixelated images et al. Conversion from MOD to DV AVI (via MPEG Streamclip) has been the workaround. As I understand it, basically, these MOD files are standard, whereas the TOD files are the HD version. Your question is the first for TOD. Are you going on what you read in the Format Support list, or have you really successfully imported MOD and/or TOD files to the Premiere Elements 8 (or any other version Premiere Elements) without problem? Online links for your camcorder seem to suggest conversion of the raw TOD to .mov for NLEs.


What is the Premiere Elements 8 project preset (new project dialog) that you set before the workspace opens? Is it:
NTSC/Hard Disk, Flash Memory Camcorders/HD 1080i30?

What are you bringing to the Timeline with the file extension TOD...MPEG2 1920 x 1080 30 frames per second? What is the run time for each clip and how many of these clips are on the Timeline that you are exporting (presumed Share/Disc/Disc with a preset of NTSC DVD Widescreen)? As per your write up, there is nothing else on the Timeline except those TOD clips? What do they look like and sound like in the Edit Mode Monitor?

You say that your computer operating system is Vista 32 bit and cite 6 GB RAM among other things. Just how much of that 6 GB RAM is actually available. Premiere Elements is a 32 bit application and, in your case, is running in a 32 bit operating system. Typically, even if you have the max 4 GB RAM installed, only about 3 to 3.5 GB RAM is available to you. So, what adjunct to your system is there that is allowing you to utilize the 6 GB RAM that is installed??? Or, did you not really want to imply that?

Before you head over to Share/Disc/Disc for your burn to disc, have you been rendering the Timeline in the Edit Mode by pressing the Enter Key of the computer main keyboard to get the best possible preview of the end product? If so, how much time does that take?

As you know, the burn time is going to be impacted by computer environment as well as Timeline content. Let us together carefully explore each. Your answers to all my questions may be a step in that direction.

ATR

TheViking
December 9th, 2009, 02:47 AM
Hi ATR,

After reading your reply, I will have to answer carefully. I am new to this(PE8) even though I have used Premiere Pro briefly.

1) Are you going on what you read in the Format Support list, or have you really successfully imported MOD and/or TOD files to the Premiere Elements 8 (or any other version Premiere Elements) without problem? Online links for your camcorder seem to suggest conversion of the raw TOD to .mov for NLEs.
1) Before I bought PE8, I did some googling and found that PE8 will recognise and use the .TOD files without any problems. I used to use the Cyberlink software thats comes with the camcorder, but I find it very time consuming. Yes, I have sucessfully imported the .TOD files to PE8 without any problems. I dont know about the conversion part(maybe it just does it without telling me).

2) What is the Premiere Elements 8 project preset (new project dialog) that you set before the workspace opens? Is it:
NTSC/Hard Disk, Flash Memory Camcorders/HD 1080i30?
2) When I first started a new project, I connected my camcorder using a Firewire cable. This is how I work on Premiere Pro. But as I said, PE8 could not 'see' the 'dv device'. So I got fed up and used USB. With USB, the PC just sees it as an ext. drive. So, I just dragged the files I need from the camcorder to a folder in the Video drive.
So the preset I selected was Hard Disk, Flash Memory Camcorders
HD 1080i 25.

3) What are you bringing to the Timeline with the file extension TOD...MPEG2 1920 x 1080 30 frames per second? What is the run time for each clip and how many of these clips are on the Timeline that you are exporting (presumed Share/Disc/Disc with a preset of NTSC DVD Widescreen)? As per your write up, there is nothing else on the Timeline except those TOD clips? What do they look like and sound like in the Edit Mode Monitor?
3) Yes, but its 1920 x 1080i 25fps. The run time for each clip is 18:24 except the last one which is 7:36. There are 7 clips in total. They look and sound normal to me, just as I would want.

4) You say that your computer operating system is Vista 32 bit and cite 6 GB RAM among other things. Just how much of that 6 GB RAM is actually available. Premiere Elements is a 32 bit application and, in your case, is running in a 32 bit operating system. Typically, even if you have the max 4 GB RAM installed, only about 3 to 3.5 GB RAM is available to you. So, what adjunct to your system is there that is allowing you to utilize the 6 GB RAM that is installed??? Or, did you not really want to imply that?
4) I just mentioned Ram to let you know that I am not lacking Ram. I know 32bit can not see more than 3GB ram anyway. When it is encoding, I have seen(task manager) PE8 uses upto 2GB ram. Buts its the CPU usagae thats worrying me. It should be doing a lot more work than what its doing right now.

5) Before you head over to Share/Disc/Disc for your burn to disc, have you been rendering the Timeline in the Edit Mode by pressing the Enter Key of the computer main keyboard to get the best possible preview of the end product? If so, how much time does that take?
5) No, I haven't tried that. I switched off background rendering but left the GPU playback on.

6) As you know, the burn time is going to be impacted by computer environment as well as Timeline content. Let us together carefully explore each. Your answers to all my questions may be a step in that direction.
6) Hope I have answered your questions accurately.

Cheers

Dev

ATR
December 9th, 2009, 09:43 AM
Dev

Regarding your question about Premiere Elements burn to disc (DVD) time related to your TOD files, from what you wrote I see several potential focus points:

You are working with TOD files which are typically problematic as such for NLE purposes

From what you wrote, you are trying to encode this TOD 1920 x 1080 25 fps video to PAL DVD-VIDEO widescreen 720 x 576 16:9 flag (downsizing by the program during the encoding process.)

Your video run time is at least 126 minutes, presumed intended burn to a DVD disc (4.7 GB/120 minutes).

I appreciate that you are concerned about your expectations for the CPU, however the following information would be helpful
1. With Premiere Elements, you say that you get about 18% encoding/burning in about 1 hour for your burn to disc (DVD). I would like to see you take this same Timeline and burn it to DVD with your Premiere Pro and tell me what the burn time is. What DVD disc are you using and what is its speed rating/what speed are you burning at?
2. With the Premiere Elements project opened and in the Share/Disc/Disc Burn Section, I would like you to place your DVD disc (presumed 4.7 GB/120 minutes), in the DVD burner tray, and give me the values for Space Required and Bitrate in the Quality Area of the Premiere Elements burn dialog.
3. For troubleshooting purposes, if you take your TOD files, convert them as you have done in the past with the Cyberlink product, and place them on the Premiere Elements Timeline, do they burn to disc any faster than do the original TOD files?
4. Also, you might want to look at burn times with and without rendering the Premiere Elements Timeline in the Edit Mode manually before the burn to disc. But, keep in mind, that this rendering process can be very time consuming.

I have never used Premiere Pro, but I suspect that at least Premiere Pro CS4 and the other CS4 family members are optimized versions, whereas as Premiere Elements is not in the same sense.

Those are my thoughts for now.

To be continued....

ATR

ATR
December 9th, 2009, 10:34 AM
Add on.....

After posting my previous post, I think that I might need to modify my suggestion for the comparison of the burn to disc for TOD with Premiere Pro and Premiere Elements 8...Premiere Pro probably does not support TOD, maybe not even MOD? I would have to check into that further.

What might have been the more appropriate suggestion to get at this aspect, is maybe a comparison of the burn time for the converted TOD, Premiere Pro vs Premiere Elements 8? Will that work?

ATR

TheViking
December 9th, 2009, 11:22 AM
Yes ATR, you are right. Premiere Pro does not support TOD files. That is why I was well happy when I heard PE8 does.

As for the Premiere Pro test, it is going to take a while. I might have to download the trial version and install it on my PC.

Since Premiere Pro does not support TOD files, I might have to conver them to somthing else. What would be the best format to convert them to?

The DVD-R speed is probably 18x.

Also, from what you are saying, if I was to burn to Blu-ray, will that make a huge difference in encoding.

As you can see, whats worrying me is why is my CPU not being used to the max. If the encoding would use all the threads at its maximum, then the encoding will take a lot less time.

I will understand if someone says that PE8 is not that great for encoding, like, if its a software thing.

Cheers

Dev.

ATR
December 9th, 2009, 11:57 AM
Dev

I have just started using PE8 recently. I have used Premiere Pro before with Matrox RT.X2, but since its too expensive to buy, I thought I will buy PE8. And also, PE8 is one of the only software that is able to recognise '.TOD' files.

Somehow I got the impression that you have used Premiere Pro for your TOD video, but with the converted version, and got acceptable burn to disc times. Was my read on that ON or OFF? That was the basis for my suggestion to go for the comparison of the burn time of same video Premiere Pro vs Premiere Elements. That type of a test run would give us a lot of valuable information.
We need to rule in or out whether encoding of this TOD source media is having an impact on your encoding time.

The size of your project is indeed an issue if you are trying to get 126 minutes onto a 120 min DVD disc.

If that Premiere Pro is not readily available and you are heading for DVD-VIDEO widescreen anyway, then will your conversion software convert the TOD 1920 x 1080 16:9 to PAL DV AVI 720 x 576 with a 16:9 flag? If so, try bringing in the DV AVI version to Premiere Elements and looking at the burn time for that to DVD-VIDEO. (But, the file size of DV AVI video is large!!!)

Does shortening the project have any impact on the burn time or does the burn time seem to hang at about 18% after 1 hour there too?

Because of the history of Premiere Elements and these MOD TOD files as well as the run time of the Timeline, these factors need to be ruled in or out before we can proceed to factor in the "CPU expectations".

I will be back later to make sure we are on the same page and how best to proceed. Even if you go to DVD double layer 8.5 GB/240 minutes or BluRay, you need the computer resources to support it.

To be continued....

ATR

TheViking
December 22nd, 2009, 10:35 AM
Hi ATR,

I haven't forgotten about this. What I am going to try is borrow a HD Sony camcorder from a friend of mine and try to see how long it takes my system to encode the footage from his camera.

If it is faster than mine, then we know where the issue is. I am also going to get this to see if it improves anything.

http://www.my-video-converter.com/tod_converter/ (http://www.my-video-converter.com/tod_converter/)

If not, then its bye-bye JVC.

Cheers

Dev

ATR
December 22nd, 2009, 12:34 PM
Dev

On the MOD side of things, the free MPEG Streamclip is the way to go to get to the DV Standard or Widescreen.
http://www.squared5.com/

I am not sure if it would handle TOD, the high definition counterpart of the MOD.

The software that you are thinking about using for the conversion is not free, so I wonder if giving the free MPEG Streamclip a try would be to your advantage.

I will be looking forward to your progress.

ATR