Not rendering transitions

[kirkfrey]

I am using PRE7 and have been having issues where it does not render the transitions between clips. It sometimes doesn’t show the transitions when I scrub and sometimes it doesn’t render them in the final output. If I move them 1 frame it seems to realize it needs to do something as the red bar above the transition shows up and then some of the transitions are rendered – generally not all of them. Is this a problem anyone else is having? I have recreated multiple scenes and the same thing happens.

I am guessing it may be related to running on Windows 7 (RC) but thought I’d ask to see if there is anything I can check.

Thanks,
Kirk

[ATR]

Lots of questions.

What is the source, format, and duration of the content of your Timeline?
Are you working with trimmed or untrimmed clips?
Please name the transition(s) involved in your Timeline?
Have you read through the details supplied by Adobe "Applying Transitions" in the program's PDF Help?
http://help.adobe.com/en_US/PremiereElements/7.0/WS09e4b3c48f3a79fc19b622510385d4355c-7e6e.html

Running across the top of the Timeline is a gray bar called the Work Area Bar. There is a tiny gray tab at each end of the Work Area Bar. The first should be at the beginning of your Timeline content and the end one should be at the end of your Timeline content.
After you apply your transition(s), have you been Rendering the Timeline by pressing the Enter Key of the computer main keyboard, so that the red line running across the top of the Timeline turns green after this Rendering?
Are you saying that you have done this and one or more transitions have red lines above them where everything else has a green line above it?

Are we talking about the same type of Rendering? I am talking about Rendering the Timeline, which is typically used for getting the best possible preview of the end product, not the rendering (encoding/exporting) of the Timeline. This process is especially important for transitions, effects, and non DV AVI content.

There are numerous reports of Premiere Elements 7 and its transitions working with problems in a Windows 7 operating system. Do you have one that is 32 or 64 bit. I am assuming that your computer is optimized, among other things with updated drivers, etc.

Right now I would look to the clips for an answer.

Please review "Applying transitions" in relation to your present Timeline clips and then please update me on your progress, including further details and clarification on what you are doing and your computer environment.

ATR

[kirkfrey]

Sounds like its likely to be Windows 7 but here I go (I am just learning so I probably will not get everything right the first time, sorry):

What is the source, format, and duration of the content of your Timeline? - Source was (mostly) Sony HD camcorder, avchd format, longest source clip is 15min but time stretched to about 2 min. the timeline total is 4 min.

Please name the transition(s) involved in your Timeline? - the only transitions I am using are Wave and Push

Have you read through the details supplied by Adobe "Applying Transitions" in the program's PDF Help?
- Yes

fter you apply your transition(s), have you been Rendering the Timeline by pressing the Enter Key of the computer main keyboard, so that the red line running across the top of the Timeline turns green after this Rendering? - Yes

Are you saying that you have done this and one or more transitions have red lines above them where everything else has a green line above it? - no, once I render the timeline the green line is solid across the timeline. when I output to any format I've tried its hit or miss if I get the transitions in the final output.

There are numerous reports of Premiere Elements 7 and its transitions working with problems in a Windows 7 operating system. Do you have one that is 32 or 64 bit. I am assuming that your computer is optimized, among other things with updated drivers, etc. - I am guessing this is the issue. it 64b with i7 quad core, 6G RAM and the latest drivers available for everything.

Given what I'd hoped to do with this computer looks like I may rebuild the box. Is XP or Vista better (I hate Vista generally) until an pdate is available for Premiere to support W7. If Vista, is 64b ok for Premiere? I know its the only way I will get access to all the RAM...

thanks for the help!

[ATR]

There are numerous reports of Premiere Elements 7 and its transitions working with problems in a Windows 7 operating system.

Sorry, but I just noticed an important typing mistake in my initial response.... that "working with problems in a Windows 7 operating system" should be "working without problems in a Windows 7 operating system"

From what I have read Windows 7 is supposed to be the Windows progression lacking the inherent liabilities of Windows Vista and possessing the inherent positive aspects of Windows XP. When I visited a relative recently, I had the chance to work briefly with Windows 7 64 bit and Premiere Elements 7. Program installed and worked fine.

What are your Window 7 computer details:
32 or 64 bit
available RAM
free hard drive space
http://forums.adobe.com/thread/390599?tstart=0

As for operating system choices...
Windows XP or Windows 7
32 vs 64 bit....Premiere Elements does not officially support 64 bit, but there are numerous reports that it is working in a 64 bit system. But remember this, Premiere Elements is a 32 bit application and runs in a 64 bit system in the 64 bit's 32 bit compatibility mode. So, your max utilization of RAM = 4 GB, not more, even if you have more RAM than that installed.

This is what I would like you to try. Do you have any DV AVI or non AVCHD video clips that you could use in a new project using the same transitions with which you are now having problems in a AVCHD Timeline? By the way, what is the Premiere Elements 7 project preset (New Project dialog) that you are setting for this "problem" project?

How are you exporting your AVCHD Timeline....
a. Share/Disc/BluRay ?
b. Share/Personal Computer/MPEG, Windows Media, ?

Fill me in on some of those points that I asked about and we will take it from there.

ATR

[kirkfrey]

64 bit
6 Gavailable RAM
60G on one part, 450 G on the other


Do you have any DV AVI or non AVCHD video clips that you could use in a new project using the same transitions with which you are now having problems in a AVCHD Timeline? I have some non-HD stuff that I can try - I've used avchd clips from the same camera in another project that worked fine (although I did jsut use "instant movie" and then tweak it, this project is built by "hand")

what is the Premiere Elements 7 project preset (New Project dialog) that you are setting for this "problem" project? - never really noticed that before :p Its the default "standard 48kHz

How are you exporting your AVCHD Timeline....
a. Share/Disc/BluRay ?
b. Share/Personal Computer/MPEG, Windows Media, ?
I've tried a number of computer formats (flash, AVI, WMV, etc) and its the same. Even when I am in the editor sometimes after I close and reopen the program the transitions don't show up. If I move them to start/stop one frame either way that seems to "remind" Premiere that they are there and it renders them. I will try to output to DVD and see what happens

Edit
______________________
I've never said, when it doesnt render the transitions it just cuts between the clips.
Edit
______________________
exported to DVD with the same results - no transitions.

[ATR]

Please check out the following to see if we are on the same page with regard to the problem that you are describing.

Miscellaneous
1. Project Preset (New Project dialog) should match as closely as possible the properties of the imported video.
If you are recording AVCHD Full 1920 x 1080 NTSC, then the Premiere Elements 7 project preset (New Project dialog) should be set at NTSC AVCHD Full HD 1080i30 which is 1920 x 1000. If you are recording 5.1 channel sound instead of Stereo, then use NTSC AVCHD Full HD 1080i30 5.1 channel. This is to set a template from which to do your edits and does not bind you selecting another export choice. So, what are the specs for your camcorder and/or what mode are you recording in? Another facet of this part of the program is whether you have “Default Scale to Frame Size” checked or unchecked. Checked will do in Edit Mode as the name of the option implies.

2. Computer Resource Considerations
If you are telling me that you are running Windows Vista 64 bit, that 6 GB RAM is available to you only when you are using the Windows Vista 64 bit with a 64 bit application. Since Premiere Elements is a 32 bit application and you have to run Premiere Elements in the 32 bit compatibility mode of the 64 bit, you do not have more than 4 GB RAM possible, and, then the question comes up, just how much of that is available. Have you used the Windows Vista Task Manager Performance to evaluate your memory situation?

60G on one part, 450 G on the other
Am I to assume that your local drive has only 60 GB free hard drive space and another external hard drive (formatted NTFS) has 450 GB free hard drive space?
In this regard, I would ask how do you have your scratch files directed (See Edit Menu/Preferences/Scratch Disks).
Memory issues can create some odd behavior. See previously cited reference on System Requirements and the recommended resources for AVCHD editing with Premiere Elements 7.
Seek out those Scratch Files and see how much has piled up in those preview/encoding/media cache folders that may be impacting computer performance. Clear them out if necessary. Also, look to see what is in that AutoSave Folder if you have been operating with that feature ON.


Issue Presented

I have looked at the Wave and Push Transitions in Premiere Elements 7. If you tell me that AVCHD from your camcorder and these transitions have worked with prior Premiere Elements 7 projects and that the only difference now is the use of Wave and Push in conjunction with an Instant Movie, then I would suggest that you may indeed me involved in a resource issue.
I have found Wave and Push Transitions to be very problematic in my Premiere Elements 7, especially with AVCHD clips on the Timeless (with probably far less computer resources that you have). I have tried trimming the clip edges, changing duration, and other properties, etc. If I played with it long enough, it seemed to work on the Timeline only after Rendering the Timeline. I have not worked on the issue beyond that.

What I am suspecting is that the more involved Wave and Push Transitions + instant movie (resource demanding) + the actual available RAM & hard drive space + plus the properties of your Premiere Elements Timeline (especially AVCHD), are pushing your resources to the limit to get the present job done.

Please do some experimenting to rule this aspect in or out....maybe by using non AVCHD footage and other choices of Premiere Elements transitions.

Please let me know what happens. I will be working on this further on my side. You may find the following online link interesting, if not now, maybe later.

http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/features/248697/edit-video-like-a-professional/page7.html

ATR

[kirkfrey]

thanks again for all your help!

1. I will keep this in mind going forward. I have a Sony HDR-Sr5 that does full 1080p/30 (I think...) with 5.1 sound. Is there any way to change this setting once the project is started?

2. my current setup is Windows 7 64b with 6G tot RAM, 4.9G currently available.

My "C drive" has 60G available and my "F drive" has 550G avaibale. Theses are just partitions on a RAID 0 strip set of 500G drives. All my scratch disks have been set to the drive with more space available, this is also where I put all my projects. Not sure if it matters but I am accessing most of the content over a gigabit network connection. I recently cleared the cache.

I will try different transitions as I just "picked" those so I am not married to them :)

My current project is not using the Instant movie, a previous one that I did not notice any issues with did. I'll do some more "messing around" and see if I can get any more data that might be helpful. I tried that link and it doesnt work??

[ATR]

1. I will keep this in mind going forward. I have a Sony HDR-Sr5 that does full 1080p/30 (I think...) with 5.1 sound. Is there any way to change this setting once the project is started?

Based the Sony Handbook PDF, I believe that the camcorder is recording AVCHD 1080i60 to this camcorder's hard drive. This "AVCHD 1080i60" is not Full 1920 x 1080 16:9 with pixel aspect ratio = square, but rather non Full 1440 x 1080 with a HD Anamorphic aspect ratio that stretches the video to 16:9 for display after encoding. See page 99 of that Sony Handbook which you can download from the Sony web site support. Further, that "i60" means to me that the capture to the camcorder's sensor is 60 fields per second which would be 30 frames per second. It says that it is recording 5.1 channel sound. Thing to remember here, Premiere Elements 7 will import 5.1 channel, but exports only Dolby Digital Stereo.

All that being said, if you were to bring this AVCHD video to Premiere Elements 7, the appropriate project preset (New Project Dialog) would be:
NTSC (If that is the region that you are in)
AVCHD
HD1080i30 5.1 channel

As for changing the project preset (New Project dialog) once it is set....the party line is NO. However, I have been involved in generating details for doing so for switching a NTSC DV Standard to NTSC DV Widescreen. Essentially, it involves right clicking the saved project prel (4:3 version), selecting Open With, selecting WordPad, followed by making appropriate changes to the WordPad document. Another aspect of making any changes to the project preset (New Project dialog) is that setting also sets the DVD Template Menu size for the project. So, you would have to change the WordPad document for aspect ratio as well as DVD Template Menu size. We can go into that another time. It might be just as easy starting a new project. But, if it is a desperate situation that is another story. I have only done this with non AVCHD projects so far.

2. my current setup is Windows 7 64b with 6G tot RAM, 4.9G currently available.
That 4.9 GB is no doubt when you are running the 64 bit operating system as 64 bit. See if you can use something like Task Manager Performance to see how much available RAM your computer has when Premiere Elements 7 is running, as it must, in the 32 bit compatibility mode of the 64 bit system.

You say that the "problem" project is not using the Instant Movie, just your AVCHD + Wave or Pulse transitions. Is this project the same length as the other project that worked with AVCHD + Instant Movie + (where there Wave + Pulse transitions)?

I tried all the links supplied so far in this thread. All are working. But, I will post that last one again
http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/features/248697/edit-video-like-a-professional/page7.html
Give the link another try and let me know if it is now available.

ATR

[kirkfrey]

good to know about the camcorder, its a few years old so I should have figured it wasn't entirely up to spec...

With Premiere 7 loaded with that project task manager shows available memory of 4.2G. Given that Pre7 is a 32b app its going to be running in 32b compat. mode which should give each process access to 3.6G of RAM. What Task Manager is showing is what is available to the system. Do I need to do anything to Pre7 other than install and run it? (if so I didn't so that may be an issue).

the problem project is roughly as long as the other one. I recreated the problem project (a couple times now) since I initially thought that maybe the project had gotten corrupt.

(the links worked until I copied and pasted them out of the board ;))

[ATR]

I believe if you have Windows XP 64 bit, you would have to set the 32 compatibility mode (99.9999% sure), but, with Windows Vista 64 bit, it is supposed to be an automatic process.

But, let us keep an open mind until we have more pieces of the issue together. I am curious to learn if:
a. using non AVCHD video (lesser demands on the computer system), such as DV AVI, has any impact on transition observations.
b. use of transitions, other than Wave or Pulse, with or without AVCHD video, has any impact on transition observations.
c. use of AVCHD video with shorter length (maybe half length of that of the present problem Timeline) has any impact on transition observations.

If that train of thought gets ruled out, then we can comfortably move on to other possibilities.

ATR

[kirkfrey]

Just to check in, it will be a couple days before I have time to get to these - sorry...

[ATR]

Thanks for the message.

I will be watching for your progress.

ATR