anybody can help me please?

[massimo]

hello my name is massimo and i'm new here,
please excuse my english i'm italian so i try my best.
i have a few questions if anybody can answer please...
i'm using a canon hf 200 avchd and i would like to edit my movie in premiere elements 7.
now, beside the fact that the playback speed in premiere is not like the original speed in the camcorder even after rendering or pass the mts files to avi files, i would like to know if it's normal the fact that even when i save the clips in a dvd and play through my 1080 tv, the speed id bad,
not smooth and not flowing right. but if i connect directly the camcorder to the tv then everything is nice and smoot with a natural speed.
why is that happening? is that normal?
thank you
massimo

[Wendy]

Hi massimo ...

... and welcome to the village :)

I will move your question over into the Premiere Elements subforum as I think you will get more replies if it is there.

Wendy

[ATR]

Massimo,

It is not unusually to have problems trying to edit AVCHD video recorded to a SDHD Memory Card as Full 1920 x 1080 60i (frame size 1920 x 1080 pixels, frame rate 60 frames per second).

Some problems are related to the computer resources and the demands of the AVCHD.
http://forums.adobe.com/thread/390599?tstart=0
http://forums.adobe.com/thread/390600?tstart=0

But, I suspect the major problem here could be the video format with its 60 fps recorded to that SDHD Memory Card.

Have you tried the following workflow?:


Use the software that came with your camera to copy and save to your computer hard drive. If there is any problem with the .mts on the hard drive, then try changing the file extension to .mpg instead of .avi which both are non recoding processes. You may have to convert your AVCHD to something else and then bring that into Premiere Elements. We will save that for last.

In Premiere Elements 7, set the project preset (New Project dialog) to:
PAL AVCHD Full HD 1080i30 and continue to the Premiere Elements workspace. (As you know, there are no 60 fps project presets in Premiere Elements New Project dialog.)

Then with Get Media/Files & Folders, bring your video into Premiere Elements 7 Media. Click on the Edit Tab (Orange) and then click on the Project Tab (Black) underneath the Edit Tab. You should be in the Project Media View.

Right click your video in Project Media View, select Interpret Footage, and, in the Interpret Footage dialog, go to Frame Rate, place a dot next to "Assume this frame rate:", and then type in 30.

Edit your video. And, then Render the Timeline by pressing the Enter key of the computer main keyboard. When the process is complete, then move on to Share/Disc/Disc for burn to disc your DVD-VIDEO as PAL_Dolby DVD.

Judge your results by playback of your DVD-VIDEO on the TV DVD player.

Do you have a BluRay burner or BluRay player so that you do not have to downconvert your 1920 x 1080 to 720 x 576?

To be continued....

ATR

[massimo]

hello,

i think my camcorder canon hf 200 already records on 30 frame rate per second. anyway i followed you instructions and: when i play back on the original provided program pixela the playback is still funky and ones i'm in the interpret footage the program is already at 30 frame per second (actually 29.9700). converting the footage in avi or mpeg help the playback quality but it's still not perfect and kind of bumpy. then when i save in dvd same resoult, yes it's in motion but... for example if i'm playing guitar on the movie my hands movement is not synchronized well. the flow is staggered frame by frame, doesn't flow naturally.
i live in miami florida so i'm using ntsc system.
also camera panning is very bad and disturbed.
when i bought the camcorder i didn't know that i have to be such a pc genius. i'm a photographer so i use photoshop quite well but this is totally a different planet...
one of my pc opetate in xp 2 gb of ram
the other is vista duo core 2gb of ram
resoult is the same in both computers.

thanks for your answer and kindness
massimo

[massimo]

i also did rendered the clips in order to make the red line green but nothing change... still that fake, unreal footage.

[ATR]

Massimo,

You say that your video frame rate is 30 frames per second??

Could you give me more details on the camera mode that you are setting? Is it:
60i
24p
30p
all with a frame size of 1920 x 1080 pixels or something else?

I assumed that your camera setting was 1080i60 (1920 x 1080 pixels with a frame rate of 60 frames per second).

ATR

[massimo]

A T R,

you were right... i was filming at 60i. sorry i just realize that!

i change to 30 frame per second now. i keep the setting at 1920 x 1080 pixels and i tried to do the capturing precess again. same resoult. still bad
playback maybe even more panning noise probably due to the slower frame rate and still the rate of playback is not natural.
i'm filming in P mode at 30frs - x.v.color on - mxp quality.
but you right... i was filming at 60i... how did you know that?
so in the future i'm i not suppose to film in 60i when using premiere?
again thank you so much for your help! i'm trying to resolve this "enigma"
from weeks so far.
massimo

[massimo]

i noticed that the specification of the camcorder sais:Frame Rate: 60i, 24p Progressive (records at 60i), 30p Progressive (records at 60i) ...
what it that mean 30p progressive (records at 60i) ??? it's a "little" confusing to me. 30 or 60i? is it me or this stuff is for advanced electronic engineer and not for regular consumer??? i bought this camera at best but not at nasa space center...

[ATR]

Massimo

You will be the best judge of the following since I do not have your Canon HF200.
I need to know specifically what mode you are using and for each mode what is the frame size and frame rate.

Here is some background information.

Frame Size
There are two frame sizes for AVCHD, one is called Full and one is not Full.
a. With the Full, the frame size = 1920 x 1080 pixels (16:9) and uses what they call a pixel aspect ratio of “square pixels”.
b. With the non Full, the frame size = 1440 x 1080 pixels (4:3) and uses what they call a pixel aspect ratio of “HD Anamorphic” which stretches the 1440 x 1080 (4:3) to 1920 x 1080 (16:9) on display after encoding.

Frame Rate
From what I have read, your 60i, 24p, and 30p shooting is all being captured by the camera sensor as interlaced video with 60 fields, not frames, per second which should be equivalent to 30 frames per second. Each frame consists of 2 fields. However, in the case of 24p and 30p, the 60i (fields) captured by the Canon sensor is then converted to 24p (no fields, 24 frames per second) or 30p (no fields, 30 frames per second).

Now we get to the hard question about what you are bringing into Premiere Elements:

a. When your camcorder is set for 1080i60, I believe it is delivering AVCHD Full interlaced 1920 x 1080 (16:9) at 60 fields per second (30 frames per second)
I think that the best description of this fields vs frames business was summed up in the following thread where the user gave the example of the window covering Venetian Blind.
All the slots = 1 frame = 2 fields
If you remove every other slot, you have removed one of the two fields.
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/canon-xh-series-hdv-camcorders/142344-60i-really-not-60fps.html

b. When your camcorder is set for 30p, I believe it is delivering AVCHD non Full 1440 x 1080 (4:3) with HD Anamorphic, using a frame rate of 30 frames per second (no fields, progressive).

c. When your camcorder is set for 24p, I believe it is delivering AVCHD non Full 1440 x 1080 (4:3) with HD Anamorphic, using a frame rate of 24 frames per second (no fields, progressive).

d. It is important to remember that Canon’s 24p and 30p were captured by Canon interlace sensor and converted to progressive in the camera in contrast to other manufacturers offer progressive captured as progressive and delivered as progressive.

It is not unusually to have problems trying to edit AVCHD video recorded to a SDHD Memory Card as Full 1920 x 1080 60i (frame size 1920 x 1080 pixels, frame rate 60 frames per second).

Please disregard in the quote where I wrote ….frame rate 60 frames per second. That should have read 60 fields per second.

My recommendations for what next will be in the next post.

ATR

[massimo]

Dear ATR,

first of all THANK YOU!!!
ok! it's not easy for me when it goes so technical but of course i'll do my best to follow you and i'll try to answer to your questions in the best way i can.

i would like to shoot my clips in the highest quality my camcorder can support.
if i understood correctly this will be AVCHD Full interlaced 1920 x 1080 (16:9) at 60 fields per second (30 frames per second). and i'll use the P (Program AE) mode.

so i plan for the moment to stick with this configuration mode in order to avoid further confusion in sharing the infos.

at the moment i don't have a blueray burner to save and compare my work at this configuration. but i'm planning to get one in the next few days. meantime i will practice with premiere elements 7 trying to produce an acceptable playback so i can edit my movies properly.

thanks again! i really appreciate your help a lot!
massimo

[ATR]

Massimo

You are doing just fine with the technical details.

I understand your goal to get the best quality from your camcorder, but keep in mind that AVCHD footage makes greater demands on your computer system. So, keep a watch on your available RAM and free hard drive space.

That is good news that you will be getting a BluRay burner soon.

If you are going to try the 1080i60 (1920 x 1080) first, I would explore:
1. Premiere Elements 7 Project Preset NTSC AVCHD Full HD 1080i30 (new project dialog)
2. In Project Media, make sure that the program has interpreted the footage correctly as 30 frames per second and that the pixel aspect ratio is square pixels.
3. After you get your video on the Timeline remember to Render the Timeline by pressing the Enter key of the computer main keyboard in order to get the best possible preview of the end product. This will not improve quality, but it will be able to see any problems, if any, to fix before export.
4. When you get to Share/Personal Computer/and the export choices, do not forget to explore the options for that export under its Advance button (if it offers one).

Remember, increasing the bitrate increases quality, but also increases file size. So, you will need to compromise there. Check out all the options under the Advance button.

If you do become involved with video that has 5.1 channel sound, remember that Premiere Elements will let you import the 5.1 channel sound, but it will export only Dolby Digital (Stereo).

Also, when you have your video on the Timeline, you might want to right click the video on the Timeline, select Field options, and experiment to see if any of those Field options has any affect on the video.

I will be watching for your progress. You may want to look at 30p next.

ATR

[massimo]

Thank you ATR,

I will follow your precious suggestions.
Thank's for your time and kindness.

Best
Massimo