Colour Matte Makes Video Track

[Bubby Grub]

Hi all, me again,
Can anyone please help. I'm now using Premier Elements 7, and am having trouble with the Colour Matte and Black Video, falling exactly where I DO NOT want it to fall.
I like to keep my Audio under the Timeline and my Video above.
My Timeline is Video 1, and I have Video 2 above.
Just under my Timeline there is Audio 1, Sound Effects, Smart Sounds, Narration, Music 1 and Music 2 in that order coming down from the Timeline.
I put my curser exactly where I want the Matte to fall, and when I bring it in, it makes an extra Video Track between the Smart Sounds and Narration tracks. I had no trouble with PE4.
Sometimes I don't even want the Matte or Black Video in the Project at that stage, but it puts it in anyway.
Can anyone tell me how I can create a Matte or Black Video and not have it come directly into the Project, before I want it? What I actually mean, is that I would prefer it to come into the folder first before the Timeline, then I have control as to where I want to put it exactly for my background. I realise that it will go before the next slide after where my curser is placed.

PART 2:
I am also having trouble naming the Tracks. I want my second Video Track to be #2, but it will name it say, #3. I go in to rename it #2 and it just automatically reverts back to #3, and I don't have another track by that name.
Can anyone please help.
Thank you all for your past help.
Bubby Grub

[Bubby Grub]

PS

I also forgot to mention that when it makes the extra video track for the
matte, it also seems to add half of the original timeline on top, and it looks like you are seeing double. The only way I can get rid of it, is to exit the project and then go back in, and it is then clear.

Thanks again

Bubby Grub

[ATR]

Bubby Grub

I am still trying to figure out how you created the Premiere Elements 7 Track arrangement that you described, so I am going to need from you a step by step by step of how it got to be:

Video 2, directly underneath that
Video 1, directly underneath that
Audio 1, directly underneath that
Sound Effects, directly underneath that
Smart Sounds, directly underneath that
Narration, directly underneath that
Music 1, directly underneath that
Music 2

In your feedback, please address the question of what kind of tracks you are renaming. It may seem a strange thought, but, when you go to rename a track and if it is one of the program's video tracks, you are not renaming that Sound Effects, Smart Sounds....?

When we understand the track arrangement, then we can go on to the Color Matte usage. One question there, when you write about the cursor location, are you referring to the mouse cursor location or the Timeline Indicator location (sometimes called the CTI)?

Your details will help me figure out what is happening. Nonetheless, I am heading back to Premiere Elements 7 and 4 to see if I can come up with your workflow for creating those tracks.

ATR

[ATR]

Add on....

With the track arrangement that you describe, is there content on each of these tracks (video and audio) before you go into the steps (Color Matte) generating the issue?

ATR

[Bubby Grub]

Thanks ATR, here is the step by step I used to name the Tracks.
The Curser I am referring to is the CTI.
This is a slide show with no video.
When I started the new project, the Timeline is Video 1, no other Video Tracks were present at that time.
The Audio Tracks by default under the Timeline were Audio 1, Narration and Soundtrack in that order.
I then inserted two new Audio Tracks.
I then renamed the Tracks as, Sound Effects, Smart Sounds, Narration, Music 1 and Music 2 in that order, with no trouble renaming them.
My next move was I added a Green Screen shot which made an extra Video Track above the Timeline. It called it Video 2. Fine.
Next I added a Colour Matte. This then split my slides (leaving a gap),
and made an extra Video Track (naming it Video 3) to take the Matte. The track it made it inserted between my Smart Sounds and Narration Tracks. I press the "Undo" button which takes out the Matte but leaves the track with nothing in it. When I press the "Delete Empty Tracks" button, it won't delete that track, but WILL delete the tracks I made. I realise it will delete the empty tracks, but why won't it delete the track I want it to delete?
Next I added another Video Track above Video 2, and it named it Video 5 (I have no Video 4 Track).
So now my Project is as follows:

The Timeline is Video 1
Directly above is Video 2
Directly above Video 2 is now Video 5

Directly below the Timeline is:
Sound Effects
Smart Sounds
The extra Video Track it put in (Video 3)
Narration
Music 1
Music 2

Every time I insert a Colour Matte it inserts a blank space in the Timeline, and puts the Matte in the Video Track it made.
My husband has even tried it on his Computer, with the same results.
I really need to be able to have the Colour Mattes in a folder ready for my use at any time. I like to be able to create them all before I get started on a Project so they are all done.
If I insert a Motion Background or a Still Background, it goes into the Folder and NOT into the Track, until I want it to.
PE4 never stuck in an extra Video track between the Audio Tracks.
It is very frustrating!
Thanks again for all your help.
Bubby Grub

[ATR]

Bubby Grub

Your renaming of the tracks has masked you from seeing what the program is programmed to do with respect to video audio track linkage. Usually my responses are on the long detailed side. This one may exceed my previous records.

Video 1
Audio 1
Narration
Soundtrack
To get that initial set up, you probably went in Edit Menu/Project Settings/Default Timeline and set Video = 1 track and Audio = 1 track.

Then you said that you added 2 Audio tracks to the starting lineup and got (after audio track renaming):
Sound Track
Smart Sounds
Narration
Music 1
Music 2
You made no mention of what became of Video 1 after the addition of these 2 audio tracks. What you no doubt did ...you must have right clicked the Timeline and used Add Tracks to set video = 0 before first track and audio = 2 before first track. What you had to see:

Video 1 was now called Video 3, directly below was
Audio 3 which you decided to call Sound Effects, directly below was
Audio 2 which you decided to call Smart Sounds, directly below was
Audio 1 which you decided to call Narration, directly below was
Narration which you decided to call Music 1, directly below was
Soundtrack which you decided to call Music 2

Did you notice that, if you went to record a narration using Premiere Elements's Add Narration, the narration clip was automatically placed on the track that was really the Narration Track and that you renamed Music? 1. Point in case, no matter what you named a track, Premiere Elements recognition was unchanged from the point of view of function for the track or its programmed video audio linkages, such as Video 1/Audio 1, Video 1/Audio 2, etc.

Now for some more video side of things....when you added the 2 audio tracks in the first place, Video 1 was automatically Premiere Elements changed that to Video 3 probably because of its relationship with Audio 3 just below it. I suspect that by this time, you had changed the name of Video 3 to Video 1. I believe that you obtained the additional video track because you got too close to the top of the other video track (originally Video 1, changed to Video 3 when you added the 2 audio tracks, and renamed by you back to Video 1). Dragging video near the top of the existing track is a common way to generate a new track without using the Timeline option Add Tracks. By the way, this new track was probably called Video 4 and you renamed it Video 2.

So now we have your Green Screen on Video 2.

Next I added a Colour Matte. This then split my slides (leaving a gap),
and made an extra Video Track (naming it Video 3) to take the Matte. The track it made it inserted between my Smart Sounds and Narration Tracks. I press the "Undo" button which takes out the Matte but leaves the track with nothing in it. When I press the "Delete Empty Tracks" button, it won't delete that track, but WILL delete the tracks I made. I realise it will delete the empty tracks, but why won't it delete the track I want it to delete?

To avoid the split, this is what you could have done.
Click New Items
Color Matte
Color Picker
BUT just do not click OK, instead holding down the ALT key of the main keyboard click OK.

Premiere Elements placed that as Video 1 and a Video 1 or Audio 1 cannot be deleted. And the reason that it ended up placed between the tracks that you are calling Smart Sounds and Narration is because Smart Sounds before renaming was Audio 2 and Narration was Audio 1. And, Video 1 (Color Matte) was being placed there because of its relationship to Audio 1. It is probably to your advantage to look at making your own color mattes, saving them to the hard drive, and bringing them into Premiere Elements Get Media Files & Folder when need in a project. If you need guidelines on how to make them in Photoshop Elements and/or Premiere Elements, I will write them up for you.
2. Remember, titles, color mattes are placed automatically on the Timeline at the position of the Timeline marker (CTI). If necessary, we can discuss what happens if there is already something in the spot where the CTI is placed.
3. We can discuss that holding down of the ALT key in placing clips in such a way as not to disrupt the Timeline content if necessary.

Re: the current Timeline in your last post
Your Timeline track arrangement with the addition of those 2 audio tracks with your renaming set off a chain of events with consequences.

Video 5, directly below
Video 2, (probably Video 4), directly below that
Video 1, (probably Video 3 after addition of those 2 audio tracks in the beginning), directly below that
Sound Effects, (probably Audio 3), directly below that
Smart Sounds, (probably Audio 2), directly below that
"The extra Video Track it put in (Video 3)"..(Video 1), directly below that
Narration (probably Audio 1), directly below that
Music 1 (probably Narration), directly below that
Music 2 (probably Soundtrack)

Well, that is my take on the cause and effect. Please check it out and see if it comes together for you the way it did for me in analyzing it.

ATR
(after awhile it started to become a maze of tracks, so let me know if how you fare with my comments)

[ATR]

Add on (correction)

Point in case, no matter what you named a track, Premiere Elements recognition was unchanged from the point of view of function for the track or its programmed video audio linkages, such as Video 1/Audio 1, Video 1/Audio 2, etc.

That should have been Video 1/Audio 1, Video 2/Audio 2, etc..

ATR

[Bubby Grub]

Hi ATR

Thanks for your quick response.
I guess after reading what you said, I guess I am kind of missing the relationship between the video and audio tracks, but I guess I thought that with Adobe you can have as many tracks as what you want, and I thought I could have them in the order I want, eg. video on top, and all audio underneath, I understand of course about any green screening, and audio if any will fall above, I fully understand and have no problem with.

I have tried out a few tests after reading your response, and if you will bear with me, I will try and explain what I have done, and the results. It will be long but here goes.

TEST ONE;
Start New Project: settings is set to 1 video track and 5 audio, (in the order Adobe put them in.) (Audio 5, Audio 4, Audio 3, Audio 2, Video 1, Audio 1, Narration, Soundtrack).

TEST TWO:
Delete all empty tracks: Have only the default, Video 1, Audio 1, Narration Soundtrack. (IF I ADD 1 VIDEO TRACK, 2 AUDIO) {AFTER LAST TRACK}
(Order as Adobe put them in, (Audio 3, Video 1, Audio 1, Normal Timeline,
Audio, Narration, Sound Track. {IF I DO A COLOUR MATTEE IT FALLS IN THE CORRECT SPOT}

TEST THREE:
Start with normal default, Timeline, Audio, Narration, Soundtrack. (Add 1 Video and 2 Audio {BEFORE FIRST TRACK}
(Order as Adobe put them in) (Timeline, Audio 3, Audio 2, Video 1, Audio1,
Narration, Soundtrack.
{NOW IF I DO A COLOUR MATTEE IT SPLITS THE CLIP, LEAVE A BLANK SPACE, THEN ADDS MATTE DOWN ON VIDEO LINE}

TEST FOUR:
Start with normal default, (Add No Video and 2 Audio Tracks) {BEFORE FIRST TRACK}
(I end up with Video 4, Audio 3, Audio 2, Audio 1, Narration, Soundtrack)
{WHICH IS EXACTLY THE ORDER I WANT, and IT WILL ALLOW ME TO RENAME THE AUDIO TRACKS TO WHAT I WANT}
{NOW TO THE COLOUR MATTE, SPLITS THE THE CLIP LEAVES A BLANK SPACE AND STICKS IT IN ON VIDEO LINE IT MAKES UNDER THE FIRST AUDIO TRACK}

Unfortunately the program is not going to do it the exact way I would like it, (WITH UNFORTUNATELY NO SOLUTION I GUESS)

POINT REGARDING NARRATION:

I have never used the add narration in Adobe, I have always used an outside program, and now use Audacity, which I am really happy with.

POINT REGARDING COLOUR MATTE AND ALT KEY:

I must be missing something, I tried it and it didn't make any difference, also my Husband tried it and he could not get it to work, as I said we must be missing something.

I thought about saving Colour Mattes to the hard drive, and just bringing them in, problem to that is that I never know exactly what colour I want till the situation arises.

Actually the reason why I want the tracks to fall in that fashion, is say I want a particular piece of music to either fade in or out, and not leave any tiny break between music, I can may be run the second piece slightly over the end of the first one, or what ever else I want at the time, and with the tracks all under each other would make it a lot easier rather than chasing all over the screen for each audio track.

Ok I hope this explains exactly what I was trying to achieve, sorry for being a pest, but as Little Nac says I always have to be different to everyone else. He often says my projects are never what anyone else would do, but I recently did 5 DVD's for a friend on one of his trips, and he was really happy, so I must be doing something right.

Actually as I am writing this Little Nac is having a problem with his. He made a brand new project, just kept the standard tracks, Adobe made, bought in his video and it just went and made a new video and audio track and stuck it in above the normal timeline, and it will not move down.

[I]PROBLEMS, PROBLEMS PROBLEMS.

I GUESS WE ARE A PROBLEM!!

Any way thanks for your patience

Bubby Grub

[ATR]

Good Morning Bubby Grub

First......exploration, experimentation, and creativity are to be encouraged. So, if you do all that find an undocumented workflow that works for you, then go with it. I think that you might have enjoyed the track arrangement of Premiere Elements 2, with the video tracks above, audio tracks below. So default, you would find:
Video 3
Video 2
Video 1
Audio 1
Audio 2
Audio 3
And, it had the Add Track and other customization options.
I do not know why Adobe decided to change the track arrangement in subsequent versions.

All that behind us,
a. if you wanted to create a color matte in Photoshop Elements and save it for later use in a Premiere Elements project, you could always change its color later in Premiere Elements by applying its Color Replacement Effect.
b. the whole issue was set in motion when you added the 2 audio tracks resulting in the program making Video 1 into Video 3, followed by your renaming which sort of masked what Premiere Elements was doing.
c. I experimented with this color matte placement issue this morning and got even more bizarre results than last night when trying to use a customized track arrangement and adding a Color Matte from New Items. The ALT key fix did work last night.

I will try and find time to look into that last matter later tonight or sooner.

With creativity comes downs and ups, so do not be discourage for looking for better. Premiere Elements often resists expanding its horizons, but sometimes can be nudged into it.

ATR