OT: Camcorders

[Codebreaker]

I'm a self proclaimed expert at Digital Photography but the only thing I know about Video is how to spell it. :)

I am looking for a camcorder though and have come up with two models....

Canon HF100 and Panasonic SD100....(these are UK numbers - US may be different but similar)

Does anyone own either of these or have any comments on them? Or even other options. I'm not going to be into serious video recording just the usual family & vacation type of thing, although I tend to be very critical of image quality.

Also I now see that Premier supports AVCHD but can it convert this to other formats and can you make adjustments to videos such as altering the Colour/Contrast/Saturation etc.

Thxs in advance
Colin

[ATR]

Colin,

I am not an expert at anything, but do like to share what works for me or from what I have read comments. So, here goes.

At this time I have only Premiere Element 4 installed. I did look at the try out Premiere Elements 7 and, if I recall correctly, should have the similar Effects choices as the 4 version
Effects/Video Effects/Adjust and then under Adjust options:
Auto Color
Auto Contrast
Auto Levels
Brightness & Contrast
Channel Mixer
Extract
Image Control
Lighting Effects
Posterize
Shadow Highlight
Most, if not all of the above offer adjustments after applying via Edit Effects.
Bottom line on these Effects: I think that they do a good job.

Since Premiere Elements 3, there has been a Sceneline View and a Timeline View. You really want to be working in the preferred Timeline View with its video/audio tracks, narration track, and soundtrack....more details on that later, if necessary. Elements 7 is the first version to support AVCHD and has AVCHD Project Presets with and without 5.1 channel sound. This 5.1 channel sound can create confusion for those who insist on using the Sceneline View with its Filmstrip with scene spots....more on that later if necessary. But, it can be frustrating if you have a camcorder that features 5.1 channel sound, but does not have an option to turn that off and switch to Stereo (2 channel) if the 5.1 channel sound becomes an issue in your Premiere Elements 7 project.

Also, do you have a Blu-Ray burner? You will need that if you plan to take your AVCHD video from the Timeline and burn it to a Blu-Ray disc with Premiere Elements 7. There are other export routes where you save your AVCHD and "burn to" with other software...maybe even a DVD disc if the AVCHD size is small enough. Do you have a player that supports Blu-Ray?

Now to get to the two camcorders that you have in mind and how that relates to the above.

1. I did a crash course in them. Both will record AVCHD (1080i) to a 8 GB SDHD Card. But with this card, it looks like at best you can record is for 1 hour (top setting) and at worst 3 hours (bottom setting). You need to look at the quality comparison between these extremes. If you opt to step up to the Panasonic that offers AVCHD to SDHD and a hard drive, you will introduce a Upper Field First/Lower Field First consideration contributed by the recording to the hard drive. But, I am not sure if that Panasonic will be recording AVCHD to that hard drive or some HD MPEG2 format.

2. The Canon has Stereo (2 channel sound) whereas the Panasonic offers the 5.1 channel sound.

What I would suggest is that you get your hands on some sample recordings from these camcorders, download the tryout Premiere Elements 7 from Adobe, and see if the results meet your quality expectations.

Before you do that you may want to review the AVCHD scene (FAQs as well as problems/solutions) at the Premiere Elements User to User Forum at Adobe:
http://www.adobeforums.com/webx/.3bb574e6/

That is it for now.

ATR

[Codebreaker]

Thanks for the useful information. I guess I have a lot of reading and playing to do over the xmas holidays. :confused:

To be honest I don't really want to get into Video Editing as I spend far too much time now just on the 'stills'

One of the reasons for asking about correction features was to do with the difference in control level of the Pansonic v Canon. Canon will allow you to adjust more parameters in camera than Panasonic. If these can be done on Premiere then the fact that the Panasonic doesn't have internal corrections doesn't seem such an issue - except for the time in front of the computer.

I think I'm leaning towards the Canon as the few reviews seem to indicate it has better image quality; but I do like the sound of the Panasonic Lens control and Viewfinder.

Colin

[ATR]

Colin,

Video recording is one thing, but video editing can get complicated once you deviate from the native format of Premiere Elements and other video editing programs, that being the format DV AVI (DV the compression type and AVI used as a wrapper). The ideal has been recording with a miniDV camcorder, then connection to computer via Firewire connection with capture into Premiere Elements. But as technology evolves "upward".........

From what I have read, AVCHD and HDV have pros and cons. At this moment in technology, HDV seems to have the edge quality wise. I would direct your attention to the competition between AVCHD and HDV, recording artifacts, editing considerations, etc.

I do not envy you your adventure.

ATR

[Codebreaker]

Thanks for confusing me even more....:)

Colin

[Codebreaker]

Hi ATR.....

Well I went for the Canon HF10 in the end. It was a good price on Amazon with a £50 rebate as well.

I've download the trial of Premiere 7 and it seems to recognise the files ok. Now I have a new toy to play with over xmas.:)

Thanks for the help

Colin

[Chuck S.]

Colin, I went for the RCA Small Wonder:

Small Wonder (http://www.mysmallwonder.com/)

That's about as much video technology (and cost!) as I can stand....

My P&S cameras have video capability as well.

Maybe I'll change my mind if/when I start having grandchildren...:)

[ATR]

Colin,

I have not graduated to camcorders. I am still at the level of an 8 MP point & shoot camera with video (just JPEG for stills and AVI MPEG4 for video). I do OK with that and my Photoshop Elements 6/Premiere Elements 4 and earlier versions. The other day I went over the deep edge and purchased Photoshop Elements 7/Premiere Elements 7. They should arrive any day.

Knowing what a keen eye you have for quality, I am looking forward to some reports on how you are doing with your new Canon camcorder and Photoshop Elements 7/Premiere Elements 7.

Have a great holiday and lots of great photo/video opportunities.

ATR

[Codebreaker]

Chuck....

That looks a neat camcorder. I hope you have some fun with it.

Colin

[Codebreaker]

ATR.....

Yes I have a keen eye for quality but I seldom acheive it - sometimes maybe I'm too harsh on myself; or so my wife says :)

Trouble is I expect the taste of caviar but with only a budget for fish fingers.

Have a great xmas holiday.

Colin

[Chuck S.]

Chuck....

That looks a neat camcorder. I hope you have some fun with it.

Colin

Colin, just kidding - it's really a toy. However, RCA and others (including Flip) have come out with HD versions for about $200, so there are options for those of us not ready to plunge into the deep end of the pool. The technology continues to evolve rapidly at both the high and low ends of the spectrum.

I've read some really good reviews of the Canon camcorders; of course, I've been a Canon fan for decades....:rolleyes:

Enjoy your new camcorder - and Premier Elements!