Shaky Transitions

[skicat]

Hi.. I have a question about transitions. I recently finished a project & burned it to DVD. On my preview screen, everything worked fine. Now, when I view it on the tv, the video shakes slightly, just before or just after the transition to the next clip (not on every one, but on many of them). :( I cant do anything about this problem on this project, but for next time, what causes this?

When placing some of the transitions, a message came on that said ther was insufficient data & some frames would be repeated. Are these the ones that might be shaking?
Thanks for your help!! :D

[tfry]

It sounds like the video clips you used didn't have enough of a *handle* for the transitions to grab onto.

Next time, when cutting your clips, give it a few more frames after the part you want so the transistion has a handle to grab to make your transition smooth.

I'm not sure why you were'nt able to see this in the playback before you burnt your project tho, usually there will be pop on one side or the other of the clip when this happens and it is very visible, in the timeline playback.

[Mike WT]

I'm wondering if either of the two "Shaky Video" situations above has been solved? My experience seems to match the situtation in this Thread, i.e. the The Video Shudder/Jerk/Shake is ONLY present ON the Burned DVD, not in the PE2 pre burn preview.

It might it be that the problem is in the compression going on in PE2 or possibly the ability of my burners to do the job with PE2? (The same source MPG file burns just fine from other Edit/Burn Software I have.).

I edited my movie (a DVR-MS converted to MPG and split into two Files (each 1 Hr 8 Min in length) All I've added were chapters.

My Part 1 Video plays great in PE2 in the pre-burn preview. But the resulting burned DVD plays jerky/shaky or with a "shudder". The occurences are periodic and frequent and occur always when there is fast motion (eg. dance scene).

My machine is a:
Pentium D 3.0 Gig
2 Gig RAM
Two - 250 Gig Drives (DMA enabled)
XP Media Center 2005 SP2
Video and Audio are integrated (INTEL D945GNT Mother Board with 800 Meg System Bus)

See D945GNT Board specs at:
http://www.intel.com/products/chipsets/945g/index.htm[/url]

In trouble shooting the problem I have:

1) Moved the files PE2 is using from the fairly full C: drive to the 70% empty D:drive for my last attempt to burn ...but to no avial.

2) I have shut down many/most programs in the start file.

3) I have burned on two different burners from (an LG GSA-4163b and a LG GSA-4166b)

4) I have used both the PE2 manual Burn Quality Slider (set to the High End) and also checked the Automatic Burn Size/Quality option on the PE2 Burn Menu, ...all to no avail.

As this is my first burn attempt (I got PE2 last week) I will try to burn some other files and report back.

Many Thanks for any insight or suggestions any one can provide!

[Mike WT]

Back again for an update....

Burned a couple more coasters... the other Edit-Burner S/W on my machine has a definite quality advantage over PE2 at this point. My second burn project was a video of mostly stills and talking heads captured off of Cable (Modern Marvels show on Modern Inventions) very little motion but some (eg. quick shots of moving train... panning out on a still shot). Both examples and others showed a video stutter on the Disc burned from PE2 ...and, I notice a general periodic picture (Pixel) instability (wavering). Overall effect with PE2 is poor. This was not fully obvious until I did a second burn with the other S/W to compare. Its quality over the PE2 burn was obvious even an hour plus later from viewing the PE2 disc.

I guess my next step will be to uninstall PE2 from my machine and reload it in the hope that perhaps that will get things as they should be (and I am sure CAN be).

More later,

Mike

[Chuck Engels]

If you are going to use other programs to capture video and use those clips in Premiere Elements there is a lot of work to do. Premiere Elements will give you flawless results from DV-AVI files it captures, otherwise you need to convert the file, reverse field order, or a number of other things to get the files to play and burn correctly. I suggest you hop over to the Adobe Premiere Elements User to User forum and search around a bit, you will find many answers to your problem.

[Mike WT]

Thank you skicat, I'll check it out.

I see that the mpg files I have opened in PE2 can be exported (Rendered?) to an .avi file and will give that a try later this morning and then burn a DVD from the avi file.

To Clarify the bigger picture in hope of yet more guidance... this is what I have been doing and my long term goal -

Capture/Edit/Burn experience to this point:
1) XP Media Center capture of shows I am interested in. (result: dvr-ms files)
2) Convert to mpg files and strip commercials with VideoReDo (result: mpg files)
3) Edit in Titles and Chapters and burning to DVD with the S/W that came with my PC (Result: Good DVDs)

Problem:
Limited Editing Ability in the freebee S/W that came with my PC/DVD Burner.

Goal:
Long term goal is to Capture and Edit to DVD, 20+ years of Family VHS tapes (and even Super 8 movies to VHS to DVD) and thus the desire for the power and quality I expect achive with PE2.

Is PE2 the right tool for a project like this?

Have you or any one else out there blazed this trail already?
If so, might you please share your experience or references ("guides" for this type of project, ...ideally with PE2).

Thank you for your help!

[Chuck Engels]

Unless you want to purchase other hardware then PE2 is not the right tool for you. I would suggest Sonic MyDVD or other MPEG editor. They are not as robust as Premiere Elements but will give you the quality you are looking for without all of the added tools and functions.

If you want to use PE2 you will need a digital converter that connects to your computer via Firewire, like the ADS Pyro Link or any converter by Canopus. This is the best method for excellent quality and the abitily to do frame accurate editing.

If you would like to see what can be done with Premiere Elements check here
http://www.chuckengels.com/PremierVideo and http://www.chuckengels.com/dec2005/videolisting_final.php?s=5

http://www.videoinasnap.com
http://www.chuckengels.com

[Mike WT]

Thank you Chuck for your response and suggestions! The web sites you directed me to have helped get me on the learning track and I will continue reading. (I actually purchased "PE2 in a SNAP" with the PE2 software and it is becoming clear the learning curve will take some time and I will have to actually read the book and a lot else I guess.)

Here is what I have tried since last time:

I exported three versions of a particularly Jerky dance clip to .avi files with three different reverse field options:
1) Lower Frame first
2) Upper Frame first
3) No Frame first, i.e. Progressive Scan.

Then I imported the three files into a PE2 timeline and burned them to a DVD. The Dance scenes remained flawed in all three versions with no, or almost no decernable difference between the three of them.

If I understand what I have been told...

I should be capturning any video that is NOT from a DV Video Camcorder, ...or other DV source..., in an "uncompressed" and "original code" format and save/convert that into an .avi file for import to PE2. Yes?

I note that if my ORIGINAL source file is ALREADY compressed (such as the DVR-MS files from Media Center [which are mpg code pretty much I believe], ...which I then convert to Standard MPG... with the compressed (DVR-MS & mpg) inputs the damage is already done and converting these to .avi is unlikely to improve on the PE2 results when burning to DVD. i.e. don't bother converting MPG to .avi, just work in PE2 with the MPG and take your chances with the results. Yes?

If I have it right my next question is whether there is any point in going through all the URLs and Guides I am directed to? ...or should I just go get Sonic MYDVD to process my casual movies & TV I am capturing for simple entertainment?

With my Family Movies project it is a different story relative to capturing Analog VHS tapes. Here I should get a DV Camcorder or Black Box Converter that inputs Analog VHS and outputs .avi to PE2 Video Capture. Then PE2 will be able and willing to do its thing (which might even include improving the video output over the original VHS in some cases?) ...or at least PE2 will keep the video at the original VHS input quality?

Much appreciate any clarification, Thanks!

Mike

[Chuck Engels]

You can get pretty much any file to work in Premiere Elements if you want to. There is a software product called VideoRedo that seems to work wonders with MPEG files in Premiere Elements. Just open the file in VideoRedo and the do a Save As renaming the file to something else and that seems to fix the issues in many cases.

For working with Media Center files you should use the software that comes with the Media Center PC to put the files on DVD.

With a digital converter, like the ADS Pyro Link or any of the Canopus models, you can capture VHS tapes, TV, Satellite, Cable, DVDs from a DVD player, anything that has S-Video, RCA, Firewire or composite video outputs. Using the converter you connect directly to your computer via firewire and Premiere Elements will handle the capture with no problems. This is by far you best option for all video capture, excellent quality and no problems.

If you want to edit mpeg files only then Sonic MyDVD 8, or now Roxio, will work fine but I don't know that even it will work with the Media Center files.
I have a list of various editing software and links here http://www.chuckengels.com/articles/index.html be sure to check out the rest of the site as well, lots of good stuff there. I just added a test tutorial on trimming clips in the media panel, it's a 23mb file though.

[Mike WT]

Hi Chuck,

I actually do have VideoReDo... that is what I used to create the MPG file from the Media Center DVR-MS files. I use it because it has a Semi-Automatic Advertizement removal feature. Reduces the size of many film burns by 20-40%.

I capture the resultant MPG file into PE2. That resulted in the shakey DVD problem in the PE2 Export DVD...which is NOT present when viewing the play back in the PE2 Monitor.

I will run the file through VideoReDo again as you suggest in hope that it may straighten something out it missed when it was first produced. Post the results when I have them.

Would appreciate your comments on my last post about using compressed files as imput to PE2. I think I am getting clear on what I need to do to deal with the Family VHS Videos. Any VHS to .AVI file black box converter recommendations?

Thanks, Mike

[Chuck Engels]

Mike, There are a few VideoRedo experts over at the Adobe forum. I would suggest you post over there to get help with your DVR files, Robert and Paul are very good with getting MPEGs and other files to work well in Premiere Elements.

As far as digital converters go if I had my choice I would get the Canopus ADVC-300 http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=308864&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation

or the 100 http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=349146&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation

But I have the cheapest, but still very good ADS Pyro AV Link http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=389754&is=REG&addedTroughType=search

[Chuck Engels]

Mike, Here is a recent post by Buz Minnow over at the Adobe forum
http://www.adobeforums.com/cgi-bin/webx?13@@.3bbecfb3/3

Posted by buz minow on 01:15pm Mar 6, 2006 Pacific
I use Vedeoredo for DVR=MS files from My Media Center PC It works Fine--But don't expect miracles
Buz

Check out that thread it will probably help you out a lot :)

[Mike WT]

Hi Chuck,

The silver lining to all this frustration and difficulty is the kind support from you and others like you in the forums I have visited all over the web these last couple of days. Thank you, Chuck!

This morning I found a post in the Adobe PE2 Forum on the same subject FYI anyone else who is interested:

http://www.adobeforums.com/cgi-bin/webx?13@772.ZdN6frbV6L5.0@.3bbed1e7/0!username=Mike%20WT&Login%20.x=18&Login%20.y=5

I will follow up on your suggestions above... but have to take a break now to do "real life" i.e. tax preparation.