Is Organizer really worth the trouble?

[Jeff Perry]

I have been reading and responding to threads in these Forums for a short while, and I have observed what appears to me to be a consistent pattern of problems associated with Organizer (PSE6 Windows version). I personally do not use Organizer, and so I don't speak with authority on the matter, but if you cruise down the list of threads on any of the Elements Forums, it seems there is no shortage of thread titles like..."Organizer Corrupted My Files, Again", or Organizer Crashes", or "Help, Problems with Organizer", or "Can't Get Organizer to Oragnize Anything Anymore".

I would appreciate hearing whether or not those users that "depend" upon Organizer for their digital asset management (DAM) functions, really think it is worth the hastle?

I personally have experienced some of the "bugs" in Editor, but is Organizer really that much more "bugggy"?

Thanks

Jeff

[TonyW]

Can't speak for others but the way I use the PSE6 Organizer I've had no problems at all - it works just fine. I have lots of images, not many tags but I use the Smart Album feature a lot to put together collections of images. At the same time I've used the Organizer since version 3 so don't abuse it. Can't help thinking that a lot of the problems people have are more operator error than program error (like moving files around without telling Elements). The problem is that if you start using it without understanding how it works it's not hard to do things that will mess it up - I know I messed up my PSE3 Organizer as soon as I installed it because I just started using it without understanding what it did and how it worked. Reading Organize Your Photos by Michael Slater finally saved me. I'm sure it has bugs like everything but I've found nothing so far that would stop me using it for managing my images.

Tony

[SharLamb]

Jeff, I totally depend on the Organizer (PSE5). It recently gave me a big problem...disconnected EVERYTHING in my elements catalog (the photo catalog was fine), and since I didn't have a proper back up, I went back and re-tagged everything. (And yes, I did the obvious things like "Restore...," etc.) It took me many boring days to accomplish that, then I made two back-ups...one on my hard drive and one on my EHD. I think you can see how important it is to me since I went to that much work to restore it. I got started using the Organizer in conjunction with Patty Debowski's system (TheDigitalScrapbookTeacher.com), and honestly don't know how any digi-scrapper copes with all the papers, templates, elements, etc. without the Organizer. Even if I were only using it for photos, I don't know how I'd get along without all the wonderful tags and collections. They help me find anything I want FAST...seconds. I haven't read the threads for the same reason I don't watch TV news--it's all depressing and there's nothing I can do about any of it (I'm not a techie, so would be no help to those having problems--in fact, I'd be the first one ASKING questions if I had such a problem). But this I know: I will do whatever it takes to maintain a healthy PSE Organizer. Shar

[Jeff Perry]

Thanks, Tony and Shar, I appreciat your thoughts about it. Let's hope that in the next version Adobe brings Windows-users into the Bridge fold AND that they give you an easy and succesful migration path. It seems like with Bridge being included in the PSE6-4-Mac version that it is probably only a mtter of time.

Jeff

[Juergen D]

Let's hope that in the next version Adobe brings Windows-users into the Bridge...
I have serious doubts that will ever happen.

The main problem I see with the Organizer is its "user unfriendliness". I am with Tony when he says:
The problem is that if you start using it without understanding how it works it's not hard to do things that will mess it up
It will allow the new user to make mistakes and has not enough safeguards built in for a person who is not familiar with the workings of a database.

I do not use the Organizer as a catalog (or database). I do not import most of my pictures. Only those needed for a special project, such as a Web Gallery. (BTW, most of my Web Galleries, however, are created with PSE2, which is customizable and HTML based.) Or possibly for a quick printing of multiple images, using the page layout.

Juergen

[SharLamb]

Maybe I lucked out, but as a BRAND NEW PSE user in November, I never had any problems with the Organizer, and it always seemed perfectly user-friendly to me. There is only one rule that has to be hammered in, and that is that you don't actually STORE your stuff in the Organizer. The Organizer is sort of a link to where your photos and scrapping elements are REALLY stored (on your hard drive). I use Canon Zoom Browser to store my photos, and my scrapping supplies are stored on my C drive in files according to the artist/source. Once I download scrapping supplies to my C drive, or upload photos to CZB, I COPY them to the Organizer by just selecting and Ctrl+dragging/dropping them as a batch. So EASY! Then the tagging begins. After that, I can find anything instantly. But everyone has their own methods & preferences. Ain't it great that we have so many choices? Shar

[efarnstrom]

Hi,
I've been using the organizer since I first bought Elements3. I had actually bought one of Adobe's album software and thought it was going to be way to difficult for me too tag everything. After trying to organize through Windows Explorer and totally forgetting where I put stuff, I took the plunge. Never looked back! I have about 30,000 images and can find anything.

I use the smart albums to keep photos tagged that are shot with different cameras. I download many photos taken by my children and the smart albums can give me immediate results if one of them want to see something they shot.

Having said all that, my only complaint with the v6 organizer is that even though it is supposedly capable of tagging up to 300,000 images, there is a caveat about working with Premiere and the organizer. I understand that Premiere doesn't 'do well' with organizers of 10,000 images or more.:( To get around this, I keep two catalogs. One with v5 with most of the images, and one with v6 with those current images that I want to use in Premiere.

Hope this helps!:)

[K:M]

Let's hope that in the next version Adobe brings Windows-users into the Bridge fold AND that they give you an easy and succesful migration path. It seems like with Bridge being included in the PSE6-4-Mac version that it is probably only a mtter of time.

Jeff

I certainly hope not! I'd refuse to upgrade unless major features of the Organizer were integrated into the Bridge!

The Bridge IMHO is NOT a viable photo management tool. The Organizer is actually a fine piece of software if used correctly. While every software has its ups and downs, I think the track record of the Bridge historically suffers more than the Organizer (remember the Bridge in CS).

I'd suggest you read the DAM Book by Peter Krogh. While it was written 3 years ago using CS2 Bridge, take a look at all the hacks in that book to get the Bridge to perform the image asset management tricks is wasn't designed to do. ( Great book, by the way! )

At the heart the Organizer's capabilities is image management : tagging, finding, organizing. And I think it does an incredible job of making it easy to tag, find and organize - among other things. I use it to manage some 50K+ digital images taken from over the last decade and to me, it is an indispensable tool. Once you have mastered it, I just can't understand how the Bridge can be seen as a viable replacement. They are fundamentally two different tools, however.

Having a lot of Photoshop CS/CS2 experience, I abhorred using the Bridge. Performance was abominable! And again, fundamentally it is not an asset management tool as the Organizer is. While I am sure this will start a number of disagreements, the tools have two different aims - and I think that is inarguable.

I personally find the usability of the Organizer quite good as an image asset management tool.

I use PSE6 Organizer + CS2 as my primary editor and PSE6 Editor for quick and dirty edits.

My 2 cents,
K:M

[kevq]

I never use organiser, preferring my own filing system
When I see the number of queries and moans about it, I not sorry that I don't use it.

Kev.

[Karin Sue]

I like Organizer. I love being able to define my own categories and tags. I have a simple organized file hierarchy and all the more complicated detailed stuff is through Organizer. No multiple copies with cryptic file names in various category folders.

I am hoping they bring Organizer to the Mac version now that it is not based on a Windows-only database. There are enough people moving back and forth between platforms that it makes sense to add the Organizer option in Mac. Maybe they could have both Bridge and Organizer for both Windows and Mac. They had both File Browser and Organizer in v3.

I am still in the dark ages of PSA and PSE2. I like having them separate and having the choice of using either Organizer or File Browser to find my files.

They really do need to do a better job of explaining Organizer though. Michael Slater's v2 book is great. I will get a copy of the v3 book when I finally upgrade my computer and install v5. I think it is time they write a new Organizer book. Maybe for v7?

The website for the Slater book is www.photofanatic.com. There are free excerpts of the book on the site. Definitely worth checking out if you use Organzier at all.

And you have to remember that its the people who are having problems that start most of the Organizer threads. Organizer doesn't really lend itself to "see what I can do" posts like Editor does. PSE6 does seem to have more than its share of bugs. I figure it counts as a v1 program since it is the first using the new database program. Hopefully most of them will be taken care of by v7.

[CalamityJanet]

Hi Jeff,
I started with PSE4 for Windows, then 5 and 6. I thought the organizer was okay once I figured out what NOT to do behind its back. Then I switched to Mac and stepped back to PSE4 and used iPhoto for organizing and liked it much better than the Organizer. Then I discovered Lightroom and now I wouldn't think of using anything else. It seems much more versatile and user friendly to me. If you shoot RAW its even better. There's a trial version of Lightroom 2.0 you can try for free if you're "invited". If you'd like to try it just PM me your email address and I'll hook you up.

[Ted D.]

I have tried to like the organizer, but I just keep leaving it. I find it too busy. Prefer XNview.

[kevq]

Some think it's great others think no.
Kev.

[johnrellis]

Obviously it depends on what you’re doing.

I am a "family memory keeper" (to use Adobe's marketing term) with about 12,000 images from digital cameras, short video clips, PDFs, and document, slide, and negative scans, going back to the early 1900's. I expect to double that number over the next year. I find the Organizer invaluable for tagging and annotating all these and publishing subsets of the images to my family.

I’ve been using Elements and Album from version 1.0 (and was one of the first alpha users of Album before it was sold to Adobe). In my experience, version 6 Organizer is by far the buggiest in many years, though the problems are not quite so severe as to motivate me to move to another solution:

http://www.adobeforums.com/webx/.59b5677c/0 (http://www.adobeforums.com/webx/.59b5677c/0)

However, I’m starting to think about moving to another program if PSE 7 continues the slide in quality. Unfortunately, Lightroom doesn’t look that attractive – it can’t handle as many file types, and it currently doesn’t import PSE 6 catalogs.

[Ric Cisson]

I don't use the Organizer, but rather import and catalog utilizing LR, which in my workflow, is so much more user friendly and less cumbersome than the Organizer. I use PSE6 for "light" edit adjustments and CS3 for heavier adjustments beyond the Preset capablilities of LR. What I really love about LR is the ability to process multiple images of similar exposure/lighting through presets, less time at the computer, more time to photograph.

[Sepiana]

Hi Jeff,

I have PE4. I gave up on the Organizer a long time ago, before I even joined the forum.

One day I got the famous error message "Organizer DB API failed to execute ....." From there, everything went downhill. I couldn't use the Organizer at all. Although I was able to restore it, I decided to play it safe. Now I open my files through the Editor, and use my own filing system.

[MazG]

I really like Organizer it is one of the reasons I prefer PSE over PS CS3. Bridge is really slow by comparison and it is much harder to set up filters.

For example, I often like to pull up my photos by date range, ranking, and by tag/keyword across my entire My Photos folder. Bridge takes forever to do this and if I do anything else afterwards I lose my search results. In contrast I can do this filter very easily in Organizer and then even save it as a smart filter so I can reuse the same search with instant results and any new files that meet the criteria are added automatically.

I find in Bridge I always end up going through each folder looking for stuff which isn't easy when you file by date.

I haven't had any corruption with my database yet and have been using the organizer only since version 4.

The only thing in the Organizer that is annoying met, is that it seems to organize by last modified date and not created date. I never noticed this until recently so I'm not sure if this is version 6 thing or not. I haven't figured out how to change this or whether this is a bug/by design.