waterfalls/rapids

[Jackie]

Anyone have any suggestions on how to deal with the contrast of waterfalls or river rapids. We just retuned from the Smokey Mountains and I had such a problem with the contrast of the water and the dark green of the forests. I tried a polarizer and I tried the split ND filter but being that the scene was really not split with a bright half and dark half the ND didn't help. I do not own a solid ND filter - would that work.
Thanks,
Jackie

[GaryK]

Hi Jackie

I have a feeling from your description that the dynamic range (darkest to lightest) is out of range for the camera (likely for most cameras).
A solid ND filter would not have made a difference.. the polarizer was likely your best bet.
Shooting in RAW may have given the best shot at recovery.

What some will do is bracket the shot and then combine them in photoshop/elements using masks and what have you.
Or what is becoming very popular is trying a HDR mege in full photoshop or in software designed just for such a thing from Photomatix.

[H2O Junkie]

My experience in shooting the falls and rapids in the Smokey Mountains has been time of day. If you shoot in peak daylight it is EXTREMELY difficult to get them right. You can't change the position of the falls relative to the sun. I try to shoot them either in early morning or late afternoon. The waxing and waning light is the perfect time to offset the contrast.

http://s225.photobucket.com/albums/dd300/fastsk8r/Travel/th_amicalolafalls.jpg

This photo of Amicalola Falls in northern GA was shot in the late afternoon as the sun was falling on the horizon with a polarizer to reduce glare on the water from the sun. If you can plan your trips the next time out based on the falls or rapids position relative to the sun you will find a dramatic improvement in your photos. It's too bad you didn't post the photo in question for us to see.

[ljameso1]

Other than shooting HDR(multiple exposures to combine). The best trick is to go when there is high thin overcast to give even lighting(also good light for flower/woods photos). 2nd best trick is find a day with frequent clouds and photograph when a cloud is diffusing the sunlight.

[Edmund]

All the prior info given is right on. I have also found that a good time for the Smokies is overcast, dreary damp days. I always use a tripod, try to expose for the highlights (not blown away), manual mode, camera spot meter, shutter preferred mode, polarizer, and depending on water speed a speed of say 1/15 or 1/30 sec or lower. That will give the water that milky look. Dreary damp days are sometimes the best time for flowers and deep green moss.
Eddie:)

[Jackie]

Thanks everyone. I did use the polarizer, metered using center (should have done spot) and generally used aperature priority at f22 which did give me a shutter speed for the water to have that milky look. Using the levels adjustment layer I can lighten up the darkness of the forest quite a bit but if I had it to do again I would do as Gary suggested and shoot one for the water and a second for the dark forest. Is there a tutorial for combining images like that in Elements - I have PSE6. I didn't shoot during the peak of the day but even then it was still pretty bright. It was definitely a learning experience. I'm hoping to get another good water opportunity in the U.P. of Michigan this fall.
Thanks again ALL of you - I learn so much from this site!
Jackie

[ljameso1]

To combine images in elements, copy the one that will need the least amount removed and paste over the other. If you have a mask plug-in add a layer mask and paint black over the area wan to show from the layer below. If don't have plug-in, just add any adjustment layer and click ok without making changes, drag the layer between the 2 pic layers and hold option/alt key while hovering mouse over the dividing line of the adjustment layer and the one above until see the double moon symbol and click on it. You can now use that layer mask. There is a pretty cost effective program called photo-matix that will blend the different exposures for you.

[lexcell]

Some excellent suggestions here. When the light is too contrasty using a tripod and locking it down to take several images at varying exposures (use the highlight warning or histogram to make sure you have detail in the brightest area through the darkest area) then combining them in Photomatix to expand the tonal range of your image. I take anywhere from 5-7 frames using bracketing with one stop increments.

A polarizer will cut the reflection but will not have enough effect on the tonal range to help you.

My favorite time to photograph water is on overcast days. The sky acts like a giant softbox allowing me to capture all the detail I need from brightest whites to the shadow area in one frame. Plus, the lower light allow me to shoot at a slower shutter speed to capture the cotton candy water look.

[DebCam]

I live at the foothills of the smokies so I shoot the river quite often. Like others have said time of day and lighting is key. If the sun is out bright, you just can't get a decent shot. It doesn't matter how many filters or what kind of camera you have. I usually use a polarizer only, if at all. Just depends. I took the shot below last wed. at 7:30 a.m. tripod mounted, No polarizer. f/22 for 1 sec.
http://www.pixentral.com/hosted/1oQF9BrqZrkPu8NNVVpnGRHD5olV2S0_thumb.jpg (http://www.pixentral.com/show.php?picture=1oQF9BrqZrkPu8NNVVpnGRHD5olV2S0)

[lexcell]

Hi Deb,
You nailed it on the head with your comments and with your beautiful image. It was either an overcast day or the sun had not reached the scene yet. Very nicely done!!!

[mljrbg]

Deb, beautiful photo.

Mary Lou

[Jackie]

Linda, Laurie, and Deb -
I very much appreciate your input. I need to figure out how to post a picture on this forum so I can get comments when I have a question like the one that started this thread - oh to be computer savy!
Deb - great shot. Do you remember what river it was. We were mainly trying to shoot on the Middle Prong.
Jackie

[DebCam]

Jackie,
This was taken on what is called Laurel Creek. These are the Laurel Creek Cascades. It is the portion of the river that flows from the Cades Cove area down to the Townsend Wye. It would be up the road past where you turn to Tremont to get to Middle prong. There is a pull off right there at the cascades. Before you go through the tunnel. If you are interested, I know of some awesome falls up Middle Prong Trail. You may already know where I mean. Hope that helps.Deb

[fdlite]

I would be interested in the location of Middle Prong Trail falls. I just came back from Gatlinburg and have taken many pictures of the Laurel Creek Cascades (have the current one in my gallery).

Dane

[JulieM]

I need to figure out how to post a picture on this forum so I can get comments when I have a question like the one that started this thread - oh to be computer savy!

Jackie, why don't you start a gallery to post your photos in? There is a great video on that subject under the link at the top of the page "How to Use the Forums". Or, if you want to post to Pixentral, you can follow these instructions by Diana:

To post an image to this forum:
1. Go to www.pixentral.com (http://www.pixentral.com/)

2. Put your cursor in the blank provided for the upload (where it says your image)

3. Click on the Browse button

4. When the "Choose File" box pops up, navigate to where your photo is stored, click on your photo file, then at the bottom of the box, click the Open button

5. It will come back to Pixentral with the path to your photo shown in the blank

6. Now on the Pixentral screen, click on the Send button

7. Once your photo is loaded (you'll see it on the Pixentral screen) scroll down to the bottom of the photo where you'll see two lines of text, one that says HTML and one that says Forum

8. You need to copy all of the text in the box after "Forum"

9. An easy way to select it is to triple click on the text OR drag your mouse all the way from the first character to the last character of the text

10. Once it is selected, press Ctrl-C to copy it

11. Then go to your message on the forum here and paste your link by pressing Ctrl-V

12. You can preview it before you submit it by clicking the "Preview Post" button at the bottom of the message window

13. If it looks okay, be sure to then press the Submit Reply button to send it

Hope this is understandable and works for you.Hope to see some of your work!

[jpspikes]

JACKIE
Go to www.apogeephoto.com (http://www.apogeephoto.com) and read Jim Altebgarten's PHOTGRAPHING WATERFALLS. GOOD INFO
THANKS
JOE

[Jackie]

Deb - Great photos. Hope to go to the Smokys again next fall - any suggestions as to when is the best month.
Julie - Thanks for the info on how to post pictures - one of these days I might give it a try - have to get over feeling intimidated.
Joe - I couldn't get that site up, could be my computer because it's been giving us grief. Having someone here next week to "clean it up".
Thanks again,
Jackie