Problem taking waterfall - need quick help

[twoaussies]

I am trying to get good photos of Huka Falls in Taupo, N.Zealand. Yesterday's photos were worse than this as I was playing with the aperture setting on my Sony A100 - today was very overcast, but I still cant get the fast flowing water to look anything except a white blob. We are leaving here tomorrow, and I sure would like some advice. I gave up today and left the camera on Auto
First photo on Auto at 1/320 F9 ISO 100. It isnt too bad
Second photo on Auto at 1/100 F8. I havent tried to fix either of them. Someone please help.
Having a great time in New Zealand and do have some great other photos; this water is just giving me fits. Jean
http://www.pixentral.com/hosted/1EfHa1iHwhuYeUBNWkxM0Ekxvb6g_thumb.jpg (http://www.pixentral.com/show.php?picture=1EfHa1iHwhuYeUBNWkxM0Ekxvb6g)
http://www.pixentral.com/hosted/1KIrI1w0UExOWNaHXYYU7OBS6bKUn1_thumb.jpg (http://www.pixentral.com/show.php?picture=1KIrI1w0UExOWNaHXYYU7OBS6bKUn1)

[Rusty]

Jean, I don't have a clue.

In the first one the water looks like water - if you know what I mean :) In the second one the water appears overexposed to the point of being blown out (unless it really is solid white foam).

You said both were on Auto - I wonder what the camera was metering on in the second one? The foliage appears properly exposed so that could explain why the sky and the water appears to be overexposed.

There are apparently extreme exposure variations here so I would try to expose for the "brighter areas". If you want to leave it on Auto, just try to make it do the metering on the bright parts. You can fix the underexposed parts of the image later in elements but you can't fix blown highlights.

I would take a lot of shots - some on Auto and then get into your adjustable modes and bracket the exposures. If you want the smooth, smoky look for the water, put your camera on a tripod and take some long exposures - very high f-stop and slow exposures. If you put it on Shutter Priority you can select the slow speed (1/3, 1/5, 1 sec, etc) and see if the camera can figure out a high enough f-stop to make it work. Or, conversely, put it on A-priority, dial in a very high f-stop and see what shutter speed the camera comes up with.

Finally, go wild with Manual and you control both shutter and f-stop (I don't do very well at that :))

Good luck,
Rusty

[twoaussies]

Hi Rusty, that was quick, I figured everyone in the States was asleep. I dont have a tripod with me; but shall put the speed down as low as I can hand hold and support the camera on the railing. A light bulb went on when you asked what the camera was metering on in the second photo. I think it was metering on the bushes. I just cant get the lens to focus on the water, so moved the camera to the bushes to get it locked it. Ah, light bulb moment - so the camera was focusing on the dark foliage and not the water. Shall concentrate on the water.
This one was at 1/80 at F10 on Auto, probably the camera was focusing more on the water than the foliage. Many thanks for your suggestions. Jean
http://www.pixentral.com/hosted/1m1hPc2i9UbyQhwBiWr8kPIvp9EPN1_thumb.jpg (http://www.pixentral.com/show.php?picture=1m1hPc2i9UbyQhwBiWr8kPIvp9EPN1)

[nkeevers]

You learned quick! Now that looks like nice water!

[ljameso1]

Jean, You'll do better to get the camera on manual. Set the shutter speed to the slowest you can handhold(from now on lug tripod), point the camera at and zoom in on the whitest part of the water. Set an aperature setting 1&1/2-2 stops wider than your exposure meter tells you.(if it says F16 use F8-9.5). If can't zoom in on white water then meter on the trees and stop down 1-2 stops. The reason the water was blown out when the camera was on auto on the trees is that camera is set to make everything a midtone. When green foliage is midtone the white water won't have any detail as white is much brighter than midtone. To get the water accurately need to let green foliage go very dark. Of course, if you had a tripod, you could take 2 different exposures and combine them later:twisted:. If you see this too late for this falls, hope will help for others.

[GaryK]

Maybe I am missing something but wouldn't a slow shuttter speed make the water even blobbier. I would thing a fast SS would stop all the motion?:confused:

[twoaussies]

Thanks Gary, I was thinking the same thing, but interested in trying the slower shutter speed. But it is a moot point now - it is raining hard and we have to leave this area at noon. But I still want to work it out for later waterfalls. I really wanted to catch the spray and water droplets.
We did something yesterday we have never done before!!! I put the laptop in my backpack, and we sat on a bench to download the thermal geyser photos. Wanted to see if they were o.k. before moving on - they were. I think my problem was that I did indeed focus on the bushes beside the falls, as the camera would not focus on the water. Did not move down any stops to compensate.
Linda: your ideas are great - shall try that for the next falls - in Australia!!
Orakei Korako Thermals in Taupo - photo not changed at all, will do that on our return.
http://www.pixentral.com/hosted/1m9mBoC94apXZbRYG2A0WMKiFRoxgL1_thumb.jpg (http://www.pixentral.com/show.php?picture=1m9mBoC94apXZbRYG2A0WMKiFRoxgL1)
Jean

[Rusty]

Gary -

I have not yet found the "right water" to do this on but I have always liked images where water, usually flowing over or around rocks in a shallow stream, has a "smooth" look. There is enough detail to know it's water, but it's almost like liquid mercury. I'm probably not explaining it very well and I don't think these NZ images are well suited for this.

Anyway, everything I have read about "how to" says you need a pretty low shutter speed to get that look. That's why I commented as I did. But, as I say, I haven't been able to try it yet for myself.

Rusty

[GaryK]

Rusty

I have a bad tendancy to speed read the threads ( I don't know how to speed read :eek:) Sometimes I miss the point of a question.

Anyway, I thought Jean was trying to make the water less soft. No biggie.:)

[pixlbandit]

Many cameras have the ability to change the metering system. Yours is probaby 'matrix,' by default. If you set it to 'spot' or some variation thereof, you might have more control over which part of the image it is metering off of (and setting the exposure to). Also, things like beanbags (travel pillows) and stationary objects can also serve as a temporary tripod replacement.... :)
Vicki

[ljameso1]

Jean, If you want to freeze water drops, then by all means try a faster shutter speed in the 125-250 range. Be aware that if you freeze the water too much it will look odd as we are used to seeing liquid water in motion(sort of giving the uneasy feeling of a prop plane in flight with frozen propellar). Just try a lot of different shutter speeds and eventually you'll get a feel for what speed you like to picture various types of falls. Have fun in Australia.

[Moodyman]

It sounds like you are using a digital camera.
Usually the auto settings are set to LOW resolution.
ie. most six megapixel cameras when on Auto, only take photos at 1meg.
This gives you many more photos, but in reduce clarity.
Go into the menu and set the camera for 'Fine', or maximum.
The exposure thing seems to have been covered by other posts, but if you get a really great photo, you won't be able to enlarge it very much if taken at 1meg.

[fogdrip]

Many photographers get that "Smooth" water look in daylight by using a Neutral Density Filter to allow long exposure in bright light. The Neutral-part of the filter means that it does not change the color portion of the picture - just the amount of light hitting the sensor.

My Canon G6 has a built in ND Filter that allows an exposure that would normally be taken at f8 to go to f2.8 OR by using the smaller aperture to take a longer picture without overexposing the surrounding "non-moving" scenery.

A ND Filter is a great addition to a photographers "Bag of Tricks"

[twoaussies]

Thanks everyone. It was raining in Taupo on our last day, but the car somehow turned back to the Falls. I used every stop, speed and aperture, and did get some decent photos. The better ones were on higher speeds.
I cant put any photos here, as I am not on my own computer.
We are now in Sydney, in son's condo overlooking the Harbour and Opera House. I have the camera on a tripod waiting for the firework display for the APEC VIPs.
Yes, I do have a digital SLR, a Sony A100 10.2 mpx. I do use the Fine setting.
Wish me luck with the firework photos. Jean