Hue/Saturation level perplexity

[slophotos]

I have ran into a perplexity that I can't get past. I want to paint back areas of color onto a photo I turned into black/white with the hue/sat level and it's not working.

After I change my photo to b/w using the hue/sat level and sliding the saturation completely to the left and click ok, I select sat/hue thumbnail, ensure black is in foreground, change the hue/sat thumbnail to black. But sometimes the pic turns into color again instead of staying b/w. I thereby "lose" the b/w photo and thus can't paint color in. It doesn't seem to make a difference when I choose the selection brush.

Most times I have no problem, but I've now had this happen with two different photos. I'm stumped. I kept thinking it has to be something simple, but it has eluded me.

Why when the thumbnail is alt/backsp to black that the photo returns to its original color?

Any ideas?

Thanks,
Slo

[MikeH]

Hi slo...

You need to click on the mask thumbnail (to the right of the Hue / Sat thumbnail) - not the Hue / Sat thumbnail...

Then you can paint back the areas you want in colour.

Mike

[slophotos]

Ok, I have continued to experiment with other photos. Now the same thing is happening on every photo.

I phrased it wrong previously, as I have been clicking on the mask thumbnail to the right of the hue/sat thumbnail. I think what may be happening is that I am no longer able to click on just the mask thumbnail, because when I click the whole "box" (both thumbnails) get highlighted, so may be the cause of the problem. I tried resetting all tools, even though it's not a tool and it didn't do anything.

Any ideas on how to correct this?

Thanks again,

Slo

[MikeH]

Slo,

Sounds like to need to delete the preferences file...

Mike

[slophotos]

Hi Mike -

Do you mean to "delete" or "re-set"? If you mean delete then I don't know how to do it and I'd be worried about deleting something that I don't know if I could get back if need be.

I have done some research. First I went to "edit" and "preferences" and reset under general and also under "display and cursor". I couldn't tell which hue/sat would fall under. It didn't t seem to make a difference.

Then I thought to "re-set" my preferences by renaming my 3.0 folder to 3.0.old. I also tried the ctrl+alt+shift when opening editor and that didn't seem to do anything. The directions I found for re-setting says to close Elements, go to C:\Documents and Settings\ [user]\ Application Data\Adobe\Photoshop Elements (where[user] is replaced with my name) and then rename the 3.0 folder.

However, I can't seem to get past Application Data. When I open Documents and Settings, I have 6 user names. 3 have data application unavailable and the other three I can open, but none of them have Adobe in them. I can find the Adobe 3 program other ways (can't remember how now), but in that folder is many, many files and pics that I'd be concerned about losing if I rename the folder.

Any guidance someone would give is appreciated because it appears as if elements is not working correctly anymore (at least the hue/saturation)

Enjoy your day all!

Slo

[Wendy]

Slo,

When Mike said delete the prefs he meant the renaming of the folder or the ctrl+alt+shift (both do the same thing). All that happens is that the prefs folder is discarded and Elements builds a new one ... one that isn't corrupt.

So you have in fact already done that ...

I'll go back through the thread and see if I can work out what is going wrong :)

Wendy

[slophotos]

Thanks Wendy for picking up on this. You sure are responsive and helpful (as are others) and hope you get some kind of compensation!

So, if I have already done this, is that why I can't find my Adobe folder under any of my "user" folders? I did the alt+cntrl+del before I tried looking in my documents folder. I sure hope this problem can be remedied as I was relying on using it heavily this weekend!

As a side note, I think I may need to figure out why I have so many "user" folders as I think I have too many and for that I guess I contact my computer tech support folks.

Thanks a bunch,

Stacy

[Wendy]

Stacy,

I'm a Mac user so not too good at finding the right folder on a Windows machine.

Lets just try this again ... hold down the Alt, Control and Shift keys then start up the editor side of Elements ... you should get a box pop up asking if you want to delete the setting file ... say yes.

Now try the rotation again and see if it works :)

Let me know what happens

Wendy

[MikeH]

Hi Stacy,

The file you should be renaming or deleting is called Application.prefs. It is located in C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Adobe\PhotoshopElementsHelp\en_US\Preferences .

Is this the file you changed?

Mike

[Wendy]

Mike,

Thank goodness you came along ... I only speak a bit of Windows and I was stuck :)

Wendy

[MikeH]

Wendy,

Your Windows is better than my Mac :lol:

Mike

[slophotos]

Hi Wendy and Mike -

I was just able to get onto my computer today. Mike your suggestion was good because I was able to follow your directions exactly to find the application.prefs. Oddly enough, I was also able to find the adobe 3.0 folders I couldn't find yesterday. I checked again to see if the hue/sat step was working yet, but it's not.

I'm confused now. Do I try the cntrl+alt+shift when opening Elements/Editor again (because before I never got the box pop-up before)?

or go to Elements 3.0 and rename to 3.0 old?

or follow Mike's suggestion to either delete or change the name of the Application.prefs file?

If I do the last idea, would I delete or rename Application.prefs? If I delete it would I be able to get it back if for some reason I needed it again?

Thanks,

Slo

[slophotos]

Well, I decided to leap ahead and try the alt+shft+cntrl while opening elements/editor and I managed to the get the pop-up box the third time. I told it to delete the setting file.

I re-opened elements editor and it looked different from before. I'll have to explore further, but it looks like the photos I had successfully changed into b/w and painted color into are now color although the levels show that I had done the hue/sat steps, etc. In otherwords, I think I lost the work I had done.

Either way, the hue/sat still does not work in that after I desaturate through hue/sat and etc. when I change the hue/sat thumbnail to black the color pic shows up again.

Now what???

Slo

[MikeH]

Hi Stacy,

I'm confused now. Do I try the cntrl+alt+shift when opening Elements/Editor again (because before I never got the box pop-up before)?

or follow Mike's suggestion to either delete or change the name of the Application.prefs file?
There are two "Adobe approved" ways to delete the preferences file (Application.prefs) - the ctrl-alt-shift method or delete the file itself directly by going to the location I gave...

You only have one preferences file - Application.prefs - and these are just two different ways of deleting that file, so it doesn't matter which one you use.

If I do the last idea, would I delete or rename Application.prefs? If I delete it would I be able to get it back if for some reason I needed it again?
The only reason to rename a file rather than delete it would be as you say to get it back... it's good practice with files... But remember the ctrl-alt-shift method of resetting this file automatically deletes it. When you start Elements, the file is recreated again so you can just go ahead and delete it.


or go to Elements 3.0 and rename to 3.0 old?
What do you mean by this? Which file or folder have you renamed?

Mike

[slophotos]

Oh, I should have been patient.

I just read your reply Mike and renaming (idea 2 to rename 3.0 to 3.0 old) would have been the way to go. I thought I'd quickly try the alt+shift+cntrl before heading to bed - big mistake.

Any idea now? I'm not doing anything further until I hear from you again.

Slo

[MikeH]

Either way, the hue/sat still does not work in that after I desaturate through hue/sat and etc. when I change the hue/sat thumbnail to black the color pic shows up again.
Stacy,

DOH! - you said this in your first post :oops: :oops:

Filling the Hue / Sat mask (or any mask for that matter) with black removes the effect - so you are turning the mask off - that's why the colour is coming back...

Press D to set the default black foreground / white background and then hit Control-backspace to fill the mask with white. This will apply the mask to your whole photo - so the colour will be removed. Now, you can paint on the mask (with a foreground colour of black) to restore the colour where you want.

Has this sorted the problem..?

Mike

[slophotos]

Hi Mike - What does this mean? (from your post, except the faces didn't copy over: "DOH! - you said this in your first post. "

I hope I am not irritating you.

Now I'm beginning to wonder if I started combining two different effects into one? I was opening the pic, adding a hue/sat layer, removing all color by moving the sat slider all the way to the left, say ok, make sure the foreground is black, get a selection brush, then alt/backspace to change the white hue/sat thumbnail to black. The pic would stay b/w and then I would paint the color back into parts of the photo. But now, when I hit the alt/bkspc the b/w photo becomes color again and my ability to paint color into the b/w photo is gone.

Have I mixed up a step?

I think I am wrong that I lost any of my previous work.

Slo

[MikeH]

Hi Stacy,

NOOOOOO... you're not irritating me... I should have picked up in your first post that you filled the mask with black...

From what you say you are combining two things, one of which cancels the other out...

Here's what to do...

:arrow: Open the picture, press D to set the default black foreground / white background.

:arrow: Add a Hue / Sat adjustment layer. :arrow: Drag the Saturation slider all the way to the left to remove the colour.

:arrow: Click on the mask thumbnail to make the mask active.

:arrow: Select a brush and paint with black on the photo to remove the mask and reveal the colour.

:arrow: If you make a mistake and reveal an area of colour that you want black & white then just press X to set the foreground colour to white and paint the mask back.

:arrow: Before you start painting to reveal colour again, press D to switch the foreground colour back to black.

Remember - black removes the mask (so revealing what is underneath) and white applies the mask (hiding what is underneath).

Give it a try and let me know... :)

Mike

[slophotos]

Foolish Confession

I went back through the lessons and see where I went wrong. I had learned how to change a pic to b/w and then add in color - I think I learned that by reading Kelby's book. Then I learned how to highlight certain areas of the pic using hue/sat, then alt/backspace to color the changed/improved color into the photo through his on-line training - mixing the two techniques into one without realizing it.

How do you put up with us beginners?

I really appreciate everyone's time with this, particularly yours Mike. I hope you'll still be willing to help me in the future given what silly mistakes I make that lead into bigger deals!

Slo

[slophotos]

Mike -

I guess we were both writing at the same time - You, instructions and me, confession!

I just printed out your instructions and am going to follow them and see how it works. I'll get right back to you.

I can only laugh at myself (maybe I'll chuckle in my sleep being as that is what I should be doing now)!

By the way, can you tell me what you wrote means:
"DOH! - you said this in your first post."

Slo

[slophotos]

Mike -

It's amazing! Your instructions work beautifully.

Thanks so much for walking through this whole process with me.

Good night,

Slo

[slophotos]

Mike -

It's amazing! Your instructions work beautifully.

Thanks so much for walking through this whole process with me.

Good night,

Slo

[MikeH]

Stacy,

Great... I'm glad we got this sorted..! :) :)

By the way, can you tell me what you wrote means:
"DOH! - you said this in your first post.
This was directed at me... in your first post you said "Why when the thumbnail is alt/backsp to black that the photo returns to its original color? That should have told me that you had filled the mask with black which removes the mask and reveals what's underneath...

How do you put up with us beginners?. I hope you'll still be willing to help me in the future given what silly mistakes I make that lead into bigger deals!
Of course I'll help you... that's what we are here for :)... We were all beginners once and it doesn't matter how long it takes to work through something... finding an answer that solves your question is the important thing.

Goodnight... well it's 8.25am here so my day has just begun...

Mike

[slophotos]

You are very kind.

I should have looked at where you're from!

One last question. Now that I deleted the preferences what do I do to get them back? What all was lost when I deleted preferences?

Thanks,

Stacy

[Wendy]

Stacy,

Elements is pretty clever when you delete the preferences it simply creates a new set ... so you don't have to do anything to get them back.

The preferences tend to become corrupt so deleting them just creates a new set that are not corrupt :)

Wendy

[GaryK]

Stacy

I'll see if I can help. :)
When you delete the prefs file, you are kind of resetting everythng back to normal. Elements rebuilds the prefs file when it restarts. For some reason this file corrupts somewhat easily, so when anything weird starts to happen the 3 finger salute is a good start to try to fix it.

Gary.

[slophotos]

Thanks Wendy and Gary -

I will go forth and not worry!

You are all extremely helpful and a tremendous boost to Elements working for us non-techies.

Since neither of you are from the US I won't wish you a happy long weekend!

With appreciation,

Slo

[Wendy]

Hi Stacy,

Glad that we could help ... :)

Wendy